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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 09:56:42 -0500
From: T Biehn <tbiehn@...il.com>
To: Dan Kaminsky <dan@...para.com>
Cc: Joxean Koret <joxeankoret@...oo.es>,
	Full Disclosure <full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk>,
	bugtraq@...urityfocus.com
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] [Tool] DeepToad 1.1.0

I can see what you're saying, it could be useful for finding
differences in different versions of the same binary but from what I
can see Joxean's app is meant to group files of the same 'type,' not
provide 'diff' capabilities.

-Travis

On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:51 AM, Dan Kaminsky <dan@...para.com> wrote:
> I looked into a fair amount of this sort of normalization back when I was
> playing with dotplots.  The idea was to upgrade from simple Levenshtein
> string comparison (with no knowledge of variable length x86 instructions,
> pointers that shift from compile to compile, etc) to something with at least
> some domain specific knowledge.  What I found, somewhat surprisingly, was
> that dumb string comparison was more than enough.  In fact, when I compared
> pre-patch and post-patch builds, it was easy to directly see when content
> was added, removed, shifted in location, etc.  Joxean's going to have much
> the same result -- as basic as his similarity metric is, he'll get the broad
> strokes just fine.
>
> Ultimately the best approach is to build a graph of how functions interact
> and measure graph isomorphism, but of course Halvar figured that out years
> ago :)
>
> On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 3:41 PM, T Biehn <tbiehn@...il.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hmm,
>> Wouldn't it be more useful to the sec community to have a algorithm
>> that abstracts at the -interpreted- content level? That is when
>> analyzing binaries I wouldn't think that this would classify two with
>> near identical functionality together, even though it is removing a
>> significant chunk of information during the hash pass.
>>
>> I would largely assume that your algorithm, as is, works best on
>> uncompressed bitmaps. Is there something I'm missing?
>>
>> -Travis
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 3, 2010 at 6:37 AM, Joxean Koret <joxeankoret@...oo.es> wrote:
>> > Hi all,
>> >
>> > I'm happy to announce the very first public release of the open source
>> > project DeepToad, a tool for computing fuzzy hashes from files.
>> >
>> > DeepToad can generate signatures, clusterize files and/or directories
>> > and compare them. It's inspired in the very good tool ssdeep [1] and, in
>> > fact, both projects are very similar.
>> >
>> > The complete project is written in pure python and is distributed under
>> > the LGPL license [2].
>> >
>> > Links:
>> > Project's Web Page http://code.google.com/p/deeptoad/
>> > Download Web Page http://code.google.com/p/deeptoad/downloads/list
>> > Wiki http://code.google.com/p/deeptoad/w/list
>> >
>> > References:
>> > [1] http://ssdeep.sourceforge.net/
>> > [2] http://www.gnu.org/licenses/lgpl.html
>> >
>> > Regards && Happy new year!
>> > Joxean Koret
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
>> > Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
>> > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> FD1D E574 6CAB 2FAF 2921  F22E B8B7 9D0D 99FF A73C
>> http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?search=tbiehn&op=index&fingerprint=on
>> http://pastebin.com/f6fd606da
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
>
>



-- 
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http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?search=tbiehn&op=index&fingerprint=on
http://pastebin.com/f6fd606da

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