Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2007 09:53:40 -0400
From: <Glenn.Everhart@...se.com>
To: <kf_lists@...italmunition.com>, <amwilson85@...il.com>
Cc: scothir@...rosoft.com, full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
Subject: Re: Xbox live accounts are being stolen

When someone fraudulently charges your credit card you should immediately 
complain to the card issuer in writing so the charge can be reversed and
charged back to the merchant who accepted the fraudulent credentials. That is
one of the advantages of a credit card - the loss can be charged back, and
a merchant who accepts bogus information is liable if it turns out to be
fake. 

There is often a 60 day period to notify of this, so if you have not written
your card issuer before, don't delay. Some of the "wait..." tactics
can have the effect of your losing the right to get the purchase charged
back if you don't get the notice out in time.

As with any such messages, too, send with return receipt requested so you can
prove that you got the message sent and that it got to the bank. It is probably
ok to send two letters, one normal and one with return receipt, mentioning they
both exist, in case a mail room doesn't know how to handle one of them. That
is not malice, just human confusion, but it's easy to print out two letters and
might help especially if your time is now short.

Writing in like this does not mean the merchant can't make things right; it
just ensures the fraud claim gets known by the card issuer bank and that it
should not be treated as an ordinary charge on your card bill. It can also sometimes
get the merchant's attention since the bank will now be after the merchant to prove
the charge was not fraudulent...it's not just you vs. the company.

These kinds of cases are possibly harbingers of the future. Trusting some consumer owned
box as evidence of who he is is not foolproof. Bets on that being an issue with consumer
PCs, cell phones, etc.?

Glenn Everhart


-----Original Message-----
From: full-disclosure-bounces@...ts.grok.org.uk
[mailto:full-disclosure-bounces@...ts.grok.org.uk]On Behalf Of Kevin
Finisterre (lists)
Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:34 AM
To: Ashley Wilson
Cc: Scott Hirnle; full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] Xbox live accounts are being stolen


Hi Ashley... I can certainly understand your frustration. Although my  
account was "taken care of" and I was ultimately given some things to  
quiet me down, I never got an explanation of what *really* happened,  
I never got any information about who I could prosecute or anything  
like that. As you can see I had to be very vocal about the whole  
situation in order to get my issue taken care of and the process was  
quite lengthy, time consuming and frustrating, so good luck.

I have CC'd a gentleman from Microsoft that got me taken care of in  
the past. He should hopefully be able to help you out, no promises of  
course.

I think it would be fair of me to say really don't like Microsoft's  
"disclosure policy" under these circumstances.
-KF

On Aug 7, 2007, at 5:08 PM, Ashley Wilson wrote:

> Hey there,
>
> I'm so very frustrated with Microsoft and went on a search to see  
> if anyone else has had the same issue and low and behold, I came  
> across you're article of sorts.
>
> Its been over a month now, since I was hacked. I woke up on a  
> Sunday morning, check my email as I do everyday. I had 4 emails  
> from Microsoft stating I purchased 20000 Microsoft points and a  
> year subscription. As most people would, I panicked and wondered  
> what kind of insane thing happened. When I turned on my Xbox and  
> attempted to log into my account, I couldn't. My boyfriend shortly  
> after that, recovered my account on the Xbox and we came to find  
> out that my username had been changed, all my friends had been  
> deleted off my list and my motto was changed to "LOL I got jacked."
>
> I was furious to think someone could do such a thing. They not only  
> stole my account but over 400 dollars was spent on my credit card.
>
> I called Microsoft support shortly after that. I got the "run  
> around." Transferred to one agent and then another. They basically  
> accused me of giving out the information. I eventually got to speak  
> to a supervisor, who assured me that everything would be taken care  
> of. They even said they would catch the individual that did this  
> and assured me a phone call in a few days, as they had to send in a  
> full investigation the next day.
>
> 3 weeks later and I was still waiting for a call.
>
> I decided it was time for me to call them, since obviously I as a  
> customer wasn't important to them. Again, the "run around." I spoke  
> with again, another supervisor who informed me that they hadn't  
> even sent out the investigation yet. He assured me that he would  
> send it out that very day and I should receive a call within 3 days.
>
> I sat home waiting to receive a call for 3 days.
>
> Again, I never received a phone call.
>
> By the 4th day, I called again.
>
> Speaking with an agent who assured me, I will receive a call. "Its  
> under investigation now, you have to wait for a phone call."
>
> Now, 2 weeks later and I called again today.
>
> I'm told that they attempted to call me today and I have to wait to  
> speak with them because there is nothing they can do. I paid for a  
> subscription that I am not getting to use and apparently won't be  
> able to use. I'd also like to mention when he said they tried  
> calling today, he said they left a voice mail message. I don't have  
> voice mail, so I got concerned. Then he read "my phone number" It  
> wasn't even my number and I had never heard the number in my life.  
> Slightly odd, since I gave them my phone number the previous time I  
> had called.
>
> Now I'm suppose to receive a call this Thursday. We will see.... I  
> won't hold my breathe.
>
> I am so very frustrated that Microsoft as huge a cooperation as  
> they are, doesn't even have the decency to call me or reimburse me  
> for a 50 dollar Xbox live account.
>
> I apologize for this longwinded email and I'm not even sure if you  
> still care about this issue but I was quite overjoyed to see I  
> wasn't alone.
>
> Sincerely
>
> Ashley Wilson
>
> _______________________________________________
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