Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2010 18:42:08 -0400
From: Jeffrey Walton <noloader@...il.com>
To: "Thor (Hammer of God)" <Thor@...merofgod.com>
Cc: "full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk" <full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk>,
	Daniel Sichel <daniels@...derosatel.com>
Subject: Re: RDP, can it be done safely?

Hi Thor,

> This is not correct.
OK. Thanks. Larry posted a very good link.

> And one should note that this has nothing to do with “local” or
> “remote” users:  To be pedantic, *all* RDP sessions are “remote.”
Local meaning "on the local LAN". The threat model changes considerably when
users are on the LAN.

Jeff


On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 6:33 PM, Thor (Hammer of God)
<Thor@...merofgod.com>wrote:

>  This is not correct.  While the default setting for an RDP connection is
> “client-negotiate” that does not mean that you will automatically get a
> no/low bit encryption session.   And one should note that this has nothing
> to do with “local” or “remote” users:  To be pedantic, *all* RDP sessions
> are “remote.”  You can easily configure the server to require
> certificate-based TLS encryption and have a host of other transport security
> options.
>
>
>
> I’m not sure what you mean by “if the users are remote you might find it
> easier to user another remote access solution.”  That makes no sense to me.
>
>
>
> Daniel – If I understand your question, your concern with having standard
> users connecting up to and running software on a server machine, correct?
> This is typically where most people fall short in application deployment via
> terminal services.   You should certainly make sure that the users are
> standard user and that you’ve properly ACL’d off the application and data.
> The model you describe sounds relatively straight-forward in that the server
> will be a dedicated application server (if I understand correctly).  When
> you have high numbers of users where some are local administrators and they
> all have home directories with various access points to shares, etc, there
> are other, more complicated methods you must consider when deploying TS.
>
>
>
> I’ve done fair amount of work with RDP, so I’m happy to help if you can
> give me some more information.
>
>
>
> t
>
>
>
> From: full-disclosure-bounces@...ts.grok.org.uk [mailto:
> full-disclosure-bounces@...ts.grok.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jeffrey Walton
> Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 2:19 PM
>
> To: Daniel Sichel
> Cc: full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
> Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] RDP, can it be done safely?
>
>
>
> Hi Dainiel,
>
>
>
> > You might find it easier to use another remote access solution.
>
> I probably should have elaborated: if users are local, understand that RDP
> is probably un-encrypted or weakly encrypted. If the users are remote, you
> might find it easier to use another remote access solution.
>
> Jeff
>
> On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 5:04 PM, Jeffrey Walton <noloader@...il.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Dan,
>
>
>
> Where are the users located (local LAN or from an untrusted network such as
> the Internet)?
>
>
>
> If I recall correctly, RDP encryption is "turned on" from a GPO setting
> that applies to the host/server, and not just RDP [or was it strong
> encryption?] (corrections, please). So you can get a secure RDP connection
> at the cost of possibly breaking other functionality.
>
> You might find it easier to use another remote access solution.
>
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 4:35 PM, Daniel Sichel <daniels@...derosatel.com>
> wrote:
>
>    We have a boneheaded group of software developers who even in this day
> and age eschew the client server model of software for the easier dumber run
> it from the console school of design. So I have this idiotic Windows
> accounting application that MUST run on an application server, cannot be run
> from a client.  Rather than have my accounting department log in directly to
> the physical box, I would like to have them use some flavor of terminal
> services on my Windows server. My question therefore is, can I turn on RDP
> safely, without exposing my Windows server to risk of exploitation?
>
> Thanks for any help you can give.
>
> Dan S.
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