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From: Michael.Simpson at inveresk.com (Michael Simpson) Subject: AV companies better hire good lawyers soon. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/10/17/teen_hacker_is_not_guilty/ >Neil Barrett, an expert witness for the prosecution, said that Caffrey's machine showed no trace of the tell-tale signs that would be left by such an >attack but today's verdict, shows that this did not persuade the jury. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/10/28/suspected_paedophile_cleared_by_computer/ suppose the problem is yet again due to difficulties in transferring tech concepts into non-tech peoples' understanding but in view of precedents set if one was to be undertaking some action that may be illegal wherever then presumably, at least in uk, by running open axs wifi network node one could use the "h4x0rs made my windoze boxen do it through the magic of mysteriously vanishing trojans helpfully installed through the wide open access point that i failed to secure coz i'm a tard" defence reminds me of my fist time through first year at university i was in the pub for about 10 months solid that year and would have been kicked out after failing one of my resits BUT through total serendipity i had managed to acquire an active Epstein-Barr infection (glandular fever or infectious mononucleosis /"mono") at some point from kissing some girl and thus was provided with another chance for medical reasons. Hadn't suffered any symptoms from it but had proof of both it's existence within me and of recent infecton so the uni council had no option but to let me back in just becoz i was stupid enough to catch a passing infection that was in the wild crazy world >"Physician, do no harm" you've got to be joking the actual line is either physician, heal thyself (which is a joke and a bad one at that) or primum non nocere - first not pain (give em a big whack of the good stuff before starting the damage) but nowhere in the any ethics i was taught did they mention "no harm" "least harm" yes, even "least harm for society" but not "no harm", god no stay away from all health professionals as they are all dangerous to your wellbeing, except for physiotherapists cf Ivan Illich : medical nemesis 1976 mikie Frank Knobbe <frank@...bbe.us> Sent by: full-disclosure-admin@...ts.netsys.com 14/09/2004 18:11 To full-disclosure@...ts.netsys.com cc Subject Re: [Full-Disclosure] AV companies better hire good lawyers soon. > * Jason Coombs PivX Solutions: > > I work as an expert witness in addition to being an infosec > > researcher, etc. and you would not believe how terrible the quality of > > computer forensics is in the real world today. To begin with, are you > > aware that people are going to prison in the U.S. for nothing more > > than having a compromised Windows box in their possession? Could you please cite a case and precedent where this has happened? As far as I remember, someone got acquitted in the UK _because_ he was in possession of a compromised Windows box. I would assume the same could be argued here in the States. Which side were you on? Did you testify for the prosecution and put the guy away for his compromised box? Or did you fail to defend him? BTW: If you are in IT forensics, why are you complaining about the quality of it? Are you trying to improve it but struggle with it, or hit road-blocks? Or is this just frustration in dealing with these issues on a daily basis? Cheers, Frank (having testified on forensics in a court of law myself) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/octet-stream Size: 193 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.grok.org.uk/pipermail/full-disclosure/attachments/20040915/d3337ae5/signature.obj
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