Date: Wed Sep 28 12:42:27 2005
From: sk at groundzero-security.com (sk)
Subject: CORE-Impact license bypass

>what i criticize is that *lots* of companies (at least here in my
>vicinity) are selling cheap "vulnerability assessments" which actually
>are nothing more than automated security scans. this leads to the
>customer feeling safe when he's really wide open to attacks. often,
>these people's networks can be rooted in no time.
>sure, you don't have to be uber-31337 to do penetration tests (i'm
>certainly not), but it should definitely go beyond the
>"scan--+--google-for-exploit" approach.

i totally agree on that. another thing i have to say is that you can sell
your auto
penetration tests, but those which advertise with *professional* pen-tests
should actually know how to exploit a bug and understand the concept
and not just run an automated tool as thats simply a rip off of the
customer.
too many of those consultants just do the bullshit talking to convince the
customer to keep buying their services. they dont need to know much..
and certainly dont. every real professional can't do his job without manual
work.
that includes auditing custom php/cgi scripts which where written specific
for
the target system for example and such things wont be spotted by the
automated tools. this could lead to undetected command execution,sql
injection
or info leak bugs on the customer system, which a hacker will easily spot if
he
does his usual manual work. so a pen test is way more reliable and
professional
if its done with real hacking or do you think real hackers only use
automated tools ?
script kiddies do, but those are unprofessional cluless kids and its the
same compared
to penetration tests. real pen testers know how to hack a system and lame
ones just
run automated tools.

-sk

GroundZero Security Research and Software Development
http://www.groundzero-security.com

Wir widersprechen der Nutzung oder ?bermittlung unserer Daten
f?r Werbezwecke oder f?r die Markt- oder Meinungsforschung (? 28 Abs. 4
BDSG).

pub  1024D/69928CB8 2004-09-27 Stefan Klaas <sk@...undzero-security.com>
sub  2048g/2A3C7800 2004-09-27

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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bernhard Mueller" <research@...-consult.com>
To: "Full Disclosure" <full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk>
Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] CORE-Impact license bypass


> Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu wrote:
> > On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 17:53:58 +0200, Bernhard Mueller said:
> >
> > And note also that "finding a hole" and "be talented enough to create an
> > exploit" are *totally* distinct.  I found a rather nasty rootable hole
in
> > Sendmail a while back (read the release notes for 8.10.1 and the
relevant
> > manpages for the system linker - that gives enough info to figure out
what the
> > bug was). Never did create a working exploit for it - I fooled with it
for an
> > afternoon and only got as far as proving that if somebody were to spend
more
> > than an afternoon on it, they *could* produce a working exploit.
> >
>
> i agree with this. it's often much easier to find a bug than to exploit
> it (see strange heap overflows and the like), and i also don't have the
> time to spend days on disassembling and looking for attack vectors (and
> i'm sure that other people will have more fun doing just that).
> what i criticize is that *lots* of companies (at least here in my
> vicinity) are selling cheap "vulnerability assessments" which actually
> are nothing more than automated security scans. this leads to the
> customer feeling safe when he's really wide open to attacks. often,
> these people's networks can be rooted in no time.
> sure, you don't have to be uber-31337 to do penetration tests (i'm
> certainly not), but it should definitely go beyond the
> "scan--+--google-for-exploit" approach.
>
> regards,
>
> -- 
> _____________________________________________________
>
> ~  DI (FH) Bernhard Mueller
> ~  IT Security Consultant
>
> ~  SEC-Consult Unternehmensberatung GmbH
> ~  www.sec-consult.com
>
> ~  A-1080 Wien  Blindengasse 3
> ~  Tel:   +43/676/840301718
> ~  Fax:   +43/(0)1/4090307-590
> ______________________________________________________
> _______________________________________________
> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
>

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