Message-Id: <20070405191047.4e9a6767.timo.schoeler@alice-dsl.net>
Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2007 19:10:47 +0200
From: Timo Schoeler <timo.schoeler@...ce-dsl.net>
To: Paul Schmehl <pauls@...allas.edu>
Cc: full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
Subject: Re: Hackers uniting against Iran?

> >> You have to be joking when you say the greatest threat to humanity
> >> is capitalism.
> >
> > no, i'm not joking; i mentioned the 100,000+ deaths caused every
> > day (and forgot those deaths caused by civilization diseases like
> > diabetes, cancer etc. that is caused by 'your lifestyle'), i
> > mentioned wars, i mentioned killing the planet... so i don't see
> > that capitalism is NOT a thread, the greatest thread, to humanity.
> >
> Well, no one can help it if you're ignorant.
> 
> Estimates of dead from various totalitarian regimes are over a
> hundred million.  China and Russia alone almost reach that figure.
> The worldwide figure for deaths under communist regimes from 1900 to
> 1987 is estimated at almost 170 million.

err, look up the definition of communism (no, not what 'the US' says
what communism is, but what Marx & Engels, Lenin, Mandel, Thaelmann
etc. wrote).

> Japan - 3 to 10 million
> Cambodia - approximately 4 million
> Turkey - 3.5 to 4.3 million
> Vietnam - 3.8 million
> Poland - 1 million
> Pakistan - 1.5 million
> Yugoslavia - 1.7 million
> North Korea - 1.6 to 3.5 million
> Nazi Germany - 7 to 10 million
> Mexico - 1.4 to 3.3 million
> Russia - 52 million
> China - 35 million
> 
> If you total all the war dead and every category of violence you can
> think of in every democratic country on earth, you can't even get
> close to those appalling numbers.
> 
> Furthermore, no democratic country has ever started a war with
> another democratic country.

first of all, this is not true; there were several democratic
countries starting a wars between them.


on the other hand, the recent example of non-democratic countries is the
faschist US invading a dictatorship, iraq. funnily, almost 80% of the
iraq people say it was a better life for them before the US spread
their, err, democracy there with bombs.

> (That's as in zero.)  The majority of
> wars are begun between two non-democratic countries, and democratic
> countries have the lowest incidence of foreign and domestic violence
> of any form of government.  (And yes, that includes the US.)
> 
> The fact is that if all countries in the world would adopt democracy,
> there would be no more wars.

YMMD! :D

> > - Cuba has a much lower infant mortality than the US;
> >
> Wow.  I am so impressed.  US is 6.43 and Cuba is 6.22.  Statistically 
> insignificant and, without context, meaningless.

sure, while at the stock markets this would cause several men pumping
sperm into their shorts. 'meaningless'...

> Both are less than 1/10th of the rates in a lot of the garden spots
> of the world that so many liberals admire.
> 
> > - Cuba has an overall much better health care than the US (who in
> > the US is able to pay for health insurance? not that many people!)
> >
> Estimates of uninsured in the US (not including illegal immigrants)
> are in the range of 20 million.

estimates of whom? i saw different numbers on the net, and about half
of the people in the US i know (no people from bronx, but database
coders, programmers, account managers etc -- part of them with masters
degree and PhD) cannot pay their health insurance, not to speak of
health insurance for their family.

> That's about 7% of the population.
> Meanwhile, in the paradise of Cuba, they don't have chlorinated
> water, they live in dilapidated and deteriorating housing (except for
> the chosen few, of course), and sanitaton is almost non-existent.

you where there? i was. for more than two months, and i never saw a
typical 'tourist environment', not even from the far. i don't have to
rely on propaganda, and i saw a different Cuba. not the whorehouse the
US had before revolution came.

> Cuba uses a two-tier system for healthcare.  Good stuff for the party 
> members (and for viewing by the gullible) and not-so-good stuff for
> the hoi polloi.  Cuba spends 1.5% of its overal foreign purchases on
> medical imports compared to 5 times that amount for the Dominican
> Republic.

funnily, the US sends bombs out into the world; Cuba sends medicine
doctors.

> The statement that Cuba's healthcare system is first rate reveals a 
> profound ignorance of the actual conditions in Cuba.  But if you
> think it's so wonderful, perhaps you'll move there to take advantage
> of it.

in fact, i did. when my girlfriend had an appendicitis when we where
there there were hospitals in every single village (!) -- very good,
interdisciplinary hospitals. polyclinics, as they're also called.
comparing them to german hospitals was a tragedy, as the so wealthy
Germany looked so poor suddenly.

of course, 'the elite' in Germany has different treatment ;)

> > - Cuba has a much better educational system and a MUCH LOWER NUMBER
> > of illiterates than the US
> >
> Cuba's literacy rate is 96.9.  The US is 99.9.  Statistically 
> insignificant, but nice try.

NICE TRY?

"This report is the first release of the National Assessment of Adult
Literacy (NAAL) health literacy results. The results are based on
assessment tasks designed specifically to measure the health literacy
of American adults. Health literacy was reported using four performance
levels: Below Basic, Basic, Intermediate, and Proficient. The majority
of adults (53 percent) had Intermediate health literacy. About 22
percent had Basic and 14 percent had Below Basic health literacy."

http://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/

(another thing -- why does the US always say that 'America' is 'US'?
have a look at the maps; maybe you do better than your president, who
didn't find iraq!)

> > so, what of that gigantic amount of money goes to the people?
> > nothing! it's used to buy B-2 bombers and pay Halliburton.
> >
> Probably what irks you is that we can afford both B-2's

no, you can't. have a look at the gigantic debts of the US:

8.87 Trillion $$$

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

> *and* wide
> screen tvs,

waste of energy, and for what? sitting in the living room and getting
even fatter than you are now? that's funny, go whereever you like
throughout the world and you'll be able to recognize US citizens from
miles away: they're three-fold in size. and you can hear them catching
(or trying to catch) their breath from there. funny! :)

> tanks

yes, your kids like tanks. they're so much more beautiful than animals,
sunsets and the like.

> *and* BMWs

yeah, our good german cars. what a luck we had Hitler and the
opportunity for those companies to make lots of money back then!

> , fighter jets

yeah, much more beauty in it than in non-destroyed eco system. so much
more humanity in it than giving starving people some food to eat.
better destroy the food that is being produced too much (actually, 12
billion people could be fed today; but not only, but also the US
doesn't want this).

> *and* Gulfstreams.

you forgot to attach bombs and guns to it.

> The rest of your tripe isn't even worth responding to.

you obviously don't have kids and hate other human beings on the
planet, that's why you're such an asshole. your place was in germany,
1933 to 1945, really -- you would have liked it!

> Paul Schmehl (pauls@...allas.edu)
> Senior Information Security Analyst
> The University of Texas at Dallas
> http://www.utdallas.edu/ir/security/

Texas. that sez all.

do the planet a favor and shoot yourself into the sun. thanks.

_______________________________________________
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Powered by blists - more mailing lists