Message-ID: <4F08D748.7010006@oneechan.org>
Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2012 17:37:44 -0600
From: Laurelai <laurelai@...echan.org>
To: Ferenc Kovacs <tyra3l@...il.com>
Cc: full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
Subject: Re: Fwd: Rate Stratfor's Incident Response

On 1/7/12 5:31 PM, Ferenc Kovacs wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 12:03 AM, Laurelai <laurelai@...echan.org 
> <mailto:laurelai@...echan.org>> wrote:
>
>     On 1/7/12 3:50 PM, Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu
>     <mailto:Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu> wrote:
>>     On Sat, 07 Jan 2012 16:25:35 EST, Shyaam Sundhar said:
>>
>>>     Although, once they have gained popularity and to a stage where a garage
>>>     office becomes a shop floor and a @home biz becomes a rent-a-million$-building
>>>     office, it is time to shift priorities.
>>     If finding people who are competent enough to secure a payroll system for a
>>     company of 10 people is difficult, what makes you think that it's easy to find
>>     people who can secure the systems for a company of 1,000?
>>
>>     As Stratfor has demonstrated, the talent pool of *really* competent security
>>     people is shallow enough that there's not even enough to secure the security
>>     companies. And it's not just Stratfor - when was the last time this list went a
>>     week without mocking a security company for its lack of clue?  It's an industry-wide
>>     problem - there's a *severe* shortage of experts.
>>
>>     And even though schools like DeVry and ITT are churning out lots of people with
>>     entry level certifications, I'm not at all sure that helps the situation - we
>>     end up with a lot of people who are entry level, and don't realize how much
>>     they don't know. That makes them almost more dangerous than not having anybody
>>     at all. Sort of like if you walk alone through a scary part of town, you
>>     actually stand a good chance because you *know* you're alone and will act
>>     accordingly - but if you have a bodyguard with you, you're likely to act
>>     differently, and end up totally screwed when you find out said bodyguard has a
>>     belt in martial arts, but zero experience in street fighting...
>>
>>
>>
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>     Perhaps these companies should try to hire the kids owning them
>     instead of crying to the feds.
>
>
> why do you think that kiddies using tools like sqlmap would be able to 
> defend them from other kids?
>
>
> -- 
> Ferenc Kovács
> @Tyr43l - http://tyrael.hu
Because they pay the kids to own them in a safe manner to show that 
their so called expertsd are full of shit, then they fire said experts 
and hire competent people saving time money and resources, try and 
remember the guys with the certs are the ones getting owned by the 
skiddies with sqlmap so that should show you how broken the infosec 
industry is, want to fix it? Start by hiring the skids because they are 
still more competent than the guys they are owning. If that one gets 
owned you hire the guy who owned him ect... until you actually have to 
know what the hell your doing to be in infosec. Use a Darwinian approach 
to the industry.

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