Message-Id: <20080806110851.C2DBC3764CE@pmx1.sophos.com>
Date:	Wed, 6 Aug 2008 12:07:57 +0100
From:	tvrtko.ursulin@...hos.com
To:	Adrian Bunk <bunk@...nel.org>
Cc:	Arjan van de Ven <arjan@...radead.org>, Greg KH <greg@...ah.com>,
	"Press, Jonathan" <Jonathan.Press@...com>,
	linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org,
	linux-security-module@...r.kernel.org,
	malware-list@...ts.printk.net
Subject: Re: [malware-list] [RFC 0/5] [TALPA] Intro to a	linuxinterfaceforon access
 scanning

Adrian Bunk <bunk@...nel.org> wrote on 06/08/2008 11:50:08:

> On Wed, Aug 06, 2008 at 11:05:43AM +0100, tvrtko.ursulin@...hos.com 
wrote:
> > Greg KH wrote on 05/08/2008 21:26:21:
> > 
> > > > [JON PRESS]  I wouldn't call it lazy, actually.  It's more like
> > > > "economical" or "ergonomic" -- or, dare I say it -- 
"user-friendly." 
> > In
> > > > this case, the users are the AV vendors who will have to write to 
the
> > > > API that will come out of this spec.  We will be more inclined to
> > > > appreciate the SDK (for want of a better term) if it covers all 
the
> > > > bases, rather than force us to go elsewhere for some of our
> > > > requirements.  When we write SDKs, we try to make sure that our 
users
> > > > will find whatever they need.
> > > 
> > > But realize that you are adding an overhead on us, the kernel 
community,
> > > to make your life easier.  We are the ones that are taking our time 
to
> > > review and comment on this code.  We are the ones who will have to 
live
> > > with this code for forever, and maintain it over the lifetime of 
linux.
> > > So far, you all have shown no willingness to give anything back to 
us at
> > > all.
> > 
> > We all? How is that true? I for example wrote some code and am willing 
to 
> > help maintain it if it gets accepted. And as you describe it, it would 
be 
> > true for any submission because not all things are usefull for all 
people, 
> > while everything is baggage for the community. And who is the 
community? I 
> > thought all who take place in discussions, bug reporting, submitting 
code, 
> > fixing bugs etc are the community.
> 
> As an observer of this thread:
> 
> - Some set of requirements suddenly appears out of the void on 
>   linux-kernel.

Because previously it was said to go away and come back with a clear list 
of requirements. And here you make it sound like a negative thing. See 
what I am talking about?

> - Noone is able and/or willing to exactly describe the problem(s) they 
>   are trying to solve.

Hopefully we will get there. Very little time has passed since the 
discussion has started, even less considering the time zone difference for 
some.
 
> With this status quo the discussion is going nowhere - Linux kernel 
> development does not work this way.
> 
> The aim is not to include this code, but to find the best technical 
> solution for your problem(s) - no matter whether this will have anything
> in common with the list of requirements and the code posted or not.

I completely agree with that. Here I was just pointing out that what Greg 
wrote was untrue and exaggerated so not helping the discussion at all.

Tvrtko


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