linux-kernel - Re: [tip:x86/setup] x86, setup: "glove box" BIOS calls -- infrastructure

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Message-ID: <20090410113824.GA18823@elf.ucw.cz>
Date:	Fri, 10 Apr 2009 13:38:24 +0200
From:	Pavel Machek <pavel@....cz>
To:	Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu>
Cc:	Avi Kivity <avi@...hat.com>, mingo@...hat.com, hpa@...or.com,
	linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org, tglx@...utronix.de,
	hpa@...ux.intel.com, rjw@...k.pl,
	linux-tip-commits@...r.kernel.org,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@...ux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [tip:x86/setup] x86, setup: "glove box" BIOS calls --
	infrastructure

Hi!

> > Well, difference is that you can defend against arbitrary network 
> > packet, but you can't defend against arbitrarily broken BIOS. If 
> > it loops forever, or overwrites random memory place, we lost...
> 
> We could protect against random memory corruption too, if it ever 
> became a widespread problem: by executing the BIOS call in a virtual 
> machine. (We can probably use the KVM code to properly emulate big 
> real mode, etc.)

We already have problems where bios corrupts low memory area during
suspend/resume. Not sure how KVM helps.

Anyway I do agree with the patches.

> "BIOS people" are operating in a completely different culture. Time 
> to market, hardware workarounds, short-term differentiators, secret 
> bootstrap sequences and code compactness are king in that space. 
> Code quality is dead last in the list. I strongly doubt that given 
> the radically conflicting priorities a reasonable dialogue can be 
> established.

"BIOS people" control stuff like SMM mode. We can workaround some BIOS
problems, but definitely not all of them.

For servers, I guess Linux has enough of market share that we could
certify known-good servers (and maybe warn against known-bad).
									Pavel
-- 
(english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek
(cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blog.html
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