Date:	Thu, 12 Nov 2009 14:14:47 +0100
From:	Corrado Zoccolo <czoccolo@...il.com>
To:	Jens Axboe <jens.axboe@...cle.com>
Cc:	Linux-Kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	Jeff Moyer <jmoyer@...hat.com>, aaronc@...ato.unsw.edu.au
Subject: Re: [RFC, PATCH] cfq-iosched: remove redundant queuing detection code

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Jens Axboe <jens.axboe@...cle.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 10 2009, Corrado Zoccolo wrote:
>> On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 4:14 PM, Jens Axboe <jens.axboe@...cle.com> wrote:
>> > On Tue, Nov 10 2009, Corrado Zoccolo wrote:
>> >> The core block layer already has code to detect presence of command
>> >> queuing devices. We convert cfq to use that instead of re-doing the
>> >> computation.
>> >
>> > There's is the major difference that the CFQ variant is dynamic and the
>> > block layer one is not. This change came from Aaron some time ago IIRC,
>> > see commit 45333d5. It's a bit of a chicken and egg problem.
>>
>> The comment by Aaron:
>>     CFQ's detection of queueing devices assumes a non-queuing device and detects
>>     if the queue depth reaches a certain threshold.  Under some workloads (e.g.
>>     synchronous reads), CFQ effectively forces a unit queue depth,
>> thus defeating
>>     the detection logic.  This leads to poor performance on queuing hardware,
>>     since the idle window remains enabled.
>>
>> makes me think that the dynamic-off detection in cfq may really be
>> buggy (BTW this could explain the bad results on SSD Jeff observed
>> before my patch set).
>> The problem is, that once the hw_tag is 0, it is difficult for it to
>> become 1 again, as explained by Aaron, since cfq will hardly send more
>> than 1 request at a time. My patch set fixes this for SSDs (the seeky
>> readers will still be sent without idling, and if they are enough, the
>> logic will see a large enough depth to reconsider the initial
>> decision).
>>
>> So the only sound way to do the detection is to start in an
>> indeterminate state, in which CFQ behaves as if hw_tag = 1, and then,
>> if for a long observation period we never saw large depth, we switch
>> to hw_tag = 0, otherwise we stick to hw_tag = 1, without reconsidering
>> it.
>
> That is probably the better way to do it, as I said earlier it is indeed
> a chicken and egg problem. Care to patch something like that up?
Ok.

>> I think the correct logic could be pushed to the blk-core, by
>> introducing also an indeterminate bit.
>
> And I still don't think that is a good idea. The block layer case cares
> more about the capability side ("is this a good ssd?") where as the CFQ
> case incorporates process behaviour as well. I'll gladly take patches to
> improve the CFQ logic.
Ok, I'll work on CFQ side then.

What about other possible measurements (e.g. avg seek time could be
used to adjust the slice_idle parameter)? Should they go into cfq, or
in the block layer, or possibly in a separate library that is used by
cfq?

>
> --
> Jens Axboe
>
>

-- 
__________________________________________________________________________

dott. Corrado Zoccolo                          mailto:czoccolo@...il.com
PhD - Department of Computer Science - University of Pisa, Italy
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