linux-kernel - Re: [RFC] Unify KVM kernel-space and user-space code into a single project

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Message-Id: <BE2E2461-D6FB-4EFB-9B95-8404563C1E1D@suse.de>
Date:	Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:23:01 +0100
From:	Alexander Graf <agraf@...e.de>
To:	Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu>
Cc:	Avi Kivity <avi@...hat.com>, Pekka Enberg <penberg@...helsinki.fi>,
	Anthony Liguori <anthony@...emonkey.ws>,
	"Zhang, Yanmin" <yanmin_zhang@...ux.intel.com>,
	Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@...llo.nl>,
	Sheng Yang <sheng@...ux.intel.com>,
	linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org, kvm@...r.kernel.org,
	Marcelo Tosatti <mtosatti@...hat.com>,
	oerg Roedel <joro@...tes.org>,
	Jes Sorensen <Jes.Sorensen@...hat.com>,
	Gleb Natapov <gleb@...hat.com>,
	Zachary Amsden <zamsden@...hat.com>, ziteng.huang@...el.com,
	Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo <acme@...hat.com>,
	Fr?d?ric Weisbecker <fweisbec@...il.com>,
	Gregory Haskins <ghaskins@...ell.com>
Subject: Re: [RFC] Unify KVM kernel-space and user-space code into a single project


On 22.03.2010, at 12:14, Ingo Molnar wrote:

> 
> * Avi Kivity <avi@...hat.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 03/21/2010 11:54 PM, Ingo Molnar wrote:
>>> * Avi Kivity<avi@...hat.com>  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 03/21/2010 10:55 PM, Ingo Molnar wrote:
>>>>> Of course you could say the following:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  ' Thanks, I'll mark this for v2.6.36 integration. Note that we are not
>>>>>    able to add this to the v2.6.35 kernel queue anymore as the ongoing
>>>>>    usability work already takes up all of the project's maintainer and
>>>>>    testing bandwidth. If you want the feature to be merged sooner than that
>>>>>    then please help us cut down on the TODO and BUGS list that can be found
>>>>>    at XYZ. There's quite a few low hanging fruits there. '
>>>> That would be shooting at my own foot as well as the contributor's since I
>>>> badly want that RCU stuff, and while a GUI would be nice, that itch isn't on
>>>> my back.
>>> I think this sums up the root cause of all the problems i see with KVM pretty
>>> well.
>> 
>> I think we agree at last.  Neither I nor my employer are interested in 
>> running qemu as a desktop-on-desktop tool, therefore I don't invest any 
>> effort in that direction, or require it from volunteers.
> 
> Obviously your employer at least in part defers to you when it comes to KVM 
> priorities.
> 
> So, just to make this really clear, _you_ are not interested in running qemu 
> as a desktop-on-desktop tool, subsequently this kind of 
> disinterest-for-desktop-usability trickled through the whole KVM stack and 
> poisoned your attitude and your contributor's attitude.
> 
> Too sad really and it's doubly sad that you dont feel anything wrong about 
> that.

Please, don't jump to unjust conclusions.

The whole point is that there's no money behind desktop-on-desktop virtualization. Thus nobody pays people to work on it. Thus nothing significant happens in that space.

If there was someone standing up to create a really decent desktop qemu front-end I'm confident we'd even officially suggest using that. In fact, that whole discussion did come up in the weekly Qemu/KVM community call and everybody agreed heavily that we do need a desktop client.

The problem is just that there is nobody standing up. And I hope you don't expect Avi to be the one creating a GUI.


Alex

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