linux-kernel - Re: [PATCH -v2] perf, x86: try to handle unknown nmis with running perfctrs

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Message-ID: <20100816171610.GN26154@erda.amd.com>
Date:	Mon, 16 Aug 2010 19:16:10 +0200
From:	Robert Richter <robert.richter@....com>
To:	Cyrill Gorcunov <gorcunov@...il.com>
CC:	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@...radead.org>,
	Don Zickus <dzickus@...hat.com>,
	Lin Ming <ming.m.lin@...el.com>, Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu>,
	"fweisbec@...il.com" <fweisbec@...il.com>,
	"linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	"Huang, Ying" <ying.huang@...el.com>,
	Yinghai Lu <yinghai@...nel.org>,
	Andi Kleen <andi@...stfloor.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH -v2] perf, x86: try to handle unknown nmis with running
 perfctrs

On 16.08.10 12:27:06, Cyrill Gorcunov wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 04:48:36PM +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> > I liked the one without funny timestamps in better, the whole timestamps
> > thing just feels too fragile.
> > 
> 
> Me too, the former Roberts patch (if I'm not missing something) looks good
> to me.
> 
> >
> > Relying on handled > 1 to arm the back-to-back filter seems doable.

Peter, I will rip out the timestamp code from the -v2 patch. My first
patch does not deal with a 2-1-0 sequence, so it has false positives.
We do not necessarily need the timestamps if back-to-back nmis are
rare. Without using timestamps the statistically lost ratio for
unknown nmis will be as the ratio for back-to-back nmis, with
timestamps we could catch almost every unknown nmi. So if we encounter
problems we could still implement timestamp code on top.

> It's doable _but_ I think there is nothing we can do, there is no
> way (at least I known of) to check if there is latched nmi from
> perf counters. We only can assume that if there multiple counters
> overflowed most probably the next unknown nmi has the same nature,
> ie it came from perf.

As said, I think with timestamps we could be able to detect 100% of
the unknown nmis. I guess we get now more than 90% with mutliple
counters, and 100% with a single counter running. So, this is already
more than a simple improvement.

> Yes, we can loose real unknown nmi in this
> case but I think this is justified trade off. If an user need
> a precise counting of unknown nmis he should not arm perf events
> at all, if there an user with nmi button (guys where did you get this
> magic buttuns? i need one ;) he better to not arm perf events too
> otherwise he might have to click twice
> 
> (and of course we should keep in mind Andi's proposal but it
>  is a next step I think).

Yes, this patch is the first step, now we can change the nmi handler
priority. The perf handler must not have the lowest priority anymore.

> > (Also, you didn't deal with the TSC going backwards..)

Does this also happen in the case of a back-to-back nmi? I don't know
the conditions for a backward running TSC. Maybe, if an nmi is
retriggered the TSC wont be adjusted by a negative offset, I don't
know...

-Robert

-- 
Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
Operating System Research Center

--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to majordomo@...r.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/