Message-ID: <4F2FD692.5060708@codemonkey.ws>
Date:	Mon, 06 Feb 2012 07:33:06 -0600
From:	Anthony Liguori <anthony@...emonkey.ws>
To:	Avi Kivity <avi@...hat.com>
CC:	qemu-devel <qemu-devel@...gnu.org>,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	Gleb Natapov <gleb@...hat.com>, KVM list <kvm@...r.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] [RFC] Next gen kvm api

On 02/06/2012 03:34 AM, Avi Kivity wrote:
> On 02/05/2012 06:36 PM, Anthony Liguori wrote:
>> On 02/05/2012 03:51 AM, Gleb Natapov wrote:
>>> On Sun, Feb 05, 2012 at 11:44:43AM +0200, Avi Kivity wrote:
>>>> On 02/05/2012 11:37 AM, Gleb Natapov wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, Feb 02, 2012 at 06:09:54PM +0200, Avi Kivity wrote:
>>>>>> Device model
>>>>>> ------------
>>>>>> Currently kvm virtualizes or emulates a set of x86 cores, with or
>>>>>> without local APICs, a 24-input IOAPIC, a PIC, a PIT, and a number of
>>>>>> PCI devices assigned from the host.  The API allows emulating the
>>>>>> local
>>>>>> APICs in userspace.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The new API will do away with the IOAPIC/PIC/PIT emulation and defer
>>>>>> them to userspace.  Note: this may cause a regression for older
>>>>>> guests
>>>>>> that don't support MSI or kvmclock.  Device assignment will be done
>>>>>> using VFIO, that is, without direct kvm involvement.
>>>>>>
>>>>> So are we officially saying that KVM is only for modern guest
>>>>> virtualization?
>>>>
>>>> No, but older guests may have reduced performance in some workloads
>>>> (e.g. RHEL4 gettimeofday() intensive workloads).
>>>>
>>> Reduced performance is what I mean. Obviously old guests will
>>> continue working.
>>
>> An interesting solution to this problem would be an in-kernel device VM.
>
> It's interesting, yes, but has a very high barrier to implementation.
>
>>
>> Most of the time, the hot register is just one register within a more
>> complex device.  The reads are often side-effect free and trivially
>> computed from some device state + host time.
>
> Look at arch/x86/kvm/i8254.c:pit_ioport_read() for a counterexample.
> There are also interactions with other devices (for example the
> apic/ioapic interaction via the apic bus).

Hrm, maybe I'm missing it, but the path that would be hot is:

if (!status_latched && !count_latched) {
    value = kpit_elapsed()
    // manipulate count based on mode
    // mask value depending on read_state
}

This path is side-effect free, and applies relatively simple math to a time counter.

The idea would be to allow the filter to not handle an I/O request depending on 
existing state.  Anything that's modifies state (like reading the latch counter) 
would drop to userspace.

>
>>
>> If userspace had a way to upload bytecode to the kernel that was
>> executed for a PIO operation, it could either pass the operation to
>> userspace or handle it within the kernel when possible without taking
>> a heavy weight exit.
>>
>> If the bytecode can access variables in a shared memory area, it could
>> be pretty efficient to work with.
>>
>> This means that the kernel never has to deal with specific in-kernel
>> devices but that userspace can accelerator as many of its devices as
>> it sees fit.
>
> I would really love to have this, but the problem is that we'd need a
> general purpose bytecode VM with binding to some kernel APIs.  The
> bytecode VM, if made general enough to host more complicated devices,
> would likely be much larger than the actual code we have in the kernel now.

I think the question is whether BPF is good enough as it stands.  I'm not really 
sure.  I agree that inventing a new bytecode VM is probably not worth it.

>>
>> This could replace ioeventfd as a mechanism (which would allow
>> clearing the notify flag before writing to an eventfd).
>>
>> We could potentially just use BPF for this.
>
> BPF generally just computes a predicate.

Can it modify a packet in place?  I think a predicate is about right (can this 
io operation be handled in the kernel or not) but the question is whether 
there's a way produce an output as a side effect.

> We could overload the scratch
> area for storing internal state and for read results, though (and have
> an "mmio scratch register" for reading the time).

Right.

Regards,

Anthony Liguori


--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to majordomo@...r.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/

Powered by blists - more mailing lists