linux-kernel - Re: [PATCH] add some drop_caches documentation and info messsge

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Message-Id: <20121024125439.c17a510e.akpm@linux-foundation.org>
Date:	Wed, 24 Oct 2012 12:54:39 -0700
From:	Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>
To:	Michal Hocko <mhocko@...e.cz>
Cc:	linux-mm@...ck.org, Dave Hansen <dave@...ux.vnet.ibm.com>,
	KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki <kamezawa.hiroyu@...fujitsu.com>,
	KOSAKI Motohiro <kosaki.motohiro@...fujitsu.com>,
	LKML <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] add some drop_caches documentation and info messsge

On Wed, 24 Oct 2012 08:29:45 +0200
Michal Hocko <mhocko@...e.cz> wrote:

> > >
> > > +		printk(KERN_NOTICE "%s (%d): dropped kernel caches: %d\n",
> > > +			current->comm, task_pid_nr(current), sysctl_drop_caches);
> > 
> > urgh.  Are we really sure we want to do this?  The system operators who
> > are actually using this thing will hate us :(
> 
> I have no problems with lowering the priority (how do you see
> KERN_INFO?) but shouldn't this message kick them that they are doing
> something wrong? Or if somebody uses that for "benchmarking" to have a
> clean table before start is this really that invasive?

hmpf.  This patch worries me.  If there are people out there who are
regularly using drop_caches because the VM sucks, it seems pretty
obnoxious of us to go dumping stuff into their syslog.  What are they
supposed to do?  Stop using drop_caches?  But that would unfix the
problem which they fixed with drop_caches in the first case.

And they might not even have control over the code - they need to go
back to their supplier and say "please send me a new version", along
with all the additional costs and risks involed in an update.

> > More friendly alternatives might be:
> > 
> > - Taint the kernel.  But that will only become apparent with an oops
> >   trace or similar.
> > 
> > - Add a drop_caches counter and make that available in /proc/vmstat,
> >   show_mem() output and perhaps other places.
> 
> We would loose timing and originating process name in both cases which
> can be really helpful while debugging. It is fair to say that we could
> deduce the timing if we are collecting /proc/meminfo or /proc/vmstat
> already and we do collect them often but this is not the case all of the
> time and sometimes it is important to know _who_ is doing all this.

But how important is all that?  The main piece of information the
kernel developer wants is "this guy is using drop_caches a lot".  All
the other info is peripheral and can be gathered by other means if so
desired.
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to majordomo@...r.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at  http://www.tux.org/lkml/