Message-ID: <1351191980.18115.116.camel@falcor>
Date:	Thu, 25 Oct 2012 15:06:20 -0400
From:	Mimi Zohar <zohar@...ux.vnet.ibm.com>
To:	Vivek Goyal <vgoyal@...hat.com>
Cc:	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@...ssion.com>,
	Matthew Garrett <mjg@...hat.com>,
	Khalid Aziz <khalid@...ehiking.org>, kexec@...ts.infradead.org,
	horms@...ge.net.au, Dave Young <dyoung@...hat.com>,
	"H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@...or.com>,
	linux kernel mailing list <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	"Kasatkin, Dmitry" <dmitry.kasatkin@...el.com>,
	Kees Cook <keescook@...omium.org>
Subject: Re: [RFC] Kdump with signed images

On Thu, 2012-10-25 at 09:54 -0400, Vivek Goyal wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 01:43:59AM -0400, Mimi Zohar wrote:
> > On Wed, 2012-10-24 at 13:19 -0400, Vivek Goyal wrote:
> > > On Tue, Oct 23, 2012 at 09:44:59AM -0700, Eric W. Biederman wrote:
> > > > Matthew Garrett <mjg@...hat.com> writes:
> > > > 
> > > > > On Tue, Oct 23, 2012 at 10:59:20AM -0400, Vivek Goyal wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >> But what about creation of a new program which can call kexec_load()
> > > > >> and execute an unsigned kernel. Doesn't look like that will be
> > > > >> prevented using IMA.
> > 
> > Like the existing kernel modules, kexec_load() is not file descriptor
> > based.  There isn't an LSM or IMA-appraisal hook here.
> > 
> > > > > Right. Trusting userspace would require a new system call that passes in 
> > > > > a signature of the userspace binary, and the kernel would then have to 
> > > > > verify the ELF object in memory in order to ensure that it 
> > > > > matches the signature. Verifying that the copy on the filesystem is 
> > > > > unmodified isn't adequate - an attacker could simply have paused the 
> > > > > process and injected code. 
> > 
> > I haven't looked at kexec_load() in detail, but like kernel modules, I
> > think the better solution would be to pass a file descriptor, especially
> > if you're discussing a new system call.  (cc'ing Kees.)
> 
> If we decide to go for a new system call, then yes it looks like passing
> fd will make sense.
> 
> > 
> > > > Verifying the copy on the filesystem at exec time is perfectly adequate
> > > > for gating extra permissions.  Certainly that is the model everywhere
> > > > else in the signed key chain.
> > > > 
> > > > Where IMA falls short is there is no offline signing capability in IMA
> > > > itself.  I think EVM may fix that.
> > 
> > I'm not sure what you mean by offline signing capability.  IMA-appraisal
> > verifies a file's 'security.ima' xattr, which may contain a hash or a
> > digital signature.  EVM protects a file's metadata, including
> > 'security.ima'.  'security.evm' can be either an hmac or a digital
> > signature.
> 
> By offline we mean that signature generation/signing does not happen on
> system in question. It happens say on build time. IIUC, in case of IMA,
> security.ima is generated and signed on the system and that means private
> key needs to be present on the system? 

The signature for 'security.ima' can definitely be created offline.
'security.evm' can also be created offline, as long as the target's
inode and other metadata doesn't change.

> We wanted something like module signing where modules are signed at
> build time and verification happens at load time but no private key
> needs to be present on the system.

Modules are identifiable.  As long as you have some mechanism to
identify mutable vs immutable files during build, there shouldn't be a
problem.  I'd use the same private key for signing modules and all
others.

> > 
> > > [ CCing lkml. I think it is a good idea to open discussion to wider
> > > audience. Also CCing IMA/EVM folks ]
> > 
> > thanks!
> > 
> > > Based on reading following wiki page, looks like EVM also does not allow
> > > offline signing capability. And EVM is protecting IMA data to protect
> > > against offline attack. If we can assume that unisgned kernels can't be
> > > booted on the platform, then EVM might not be a strict requirement in
> > > this case.
> > 
> > > So as you said, one of the main problem with IMA use to verify /sbin/kexec
> > > is that IMA does not provide offline signing capability.
> > 
> > ?
> 
> See above.
> 
> >  
> > > > 
> > > > > Realistically, the only solution here is for 
> > > > > the kernel to verify that the kernel it's about to boot is signed and 
> > > > > for it not to take any untrusted executable code from userspace.
> > 
> > >From an IMA, as opposed to an IMA-appraisal, perspective, kexec is
> > problematic.  IMA maintains a measurement list and extends a PCR with
> > the file hash.  The measurement list and PCR value are used to attest to
> > the integrity of the running system.  As the original measurement list
> > is lost after kexec, but the PCR value hasn't been reset, the
> > measuremnet list and PCR value won't agree.
> > 
> > > > Hogwash.  The kernel verifing a signature of /sbin/kexec at exec time is
> > > > perfectly reasonable, and realistic.  In fact finding a way to trust
> > > > small bits of userspace even if root is compromised seems a far superior
> > > > model to simply solving the signing problem for /sbin/kexec.
> > 
> > Huh?  I don't understand what you're suggesting.  Once root has been
> > compromised, that's it.
> > 
> > > > Although I do admit some part of the kexec process will need to verify
> > > > keys on the images we decide to boot.
> > 
> > Which keys?  Isn't the kernel module key builtin to the kernel and
> > included in the kernel image signature?
> 
> I think Eric is referring to verifying bzImage signature. One can sign
> PE/COFF bzImage so IIUC, Eric seems to be suggesting that let /sbin/kexec
> verify the integrity/authenticity of bzImage and figure a way out to
> verify integrity/authenticity of /sbin/kexec.

Yes that would work.  IMA-appraisal/EVM would verify and enforce the
integrity of /sbin/kexec, like any other file.  Verifying the signature
of the kernel image itself could be left up to kexec.

> That way one does not have to change current logic and most of the logic
> of kexec/kdump can still be in user space. Otherwise we shall probably
> have to implement a new system call which takes kernel and initrd as
> input parameters and kernel does signature verification and prepares
> bzImage for loading. This is like re-writing kexec/kdump again with
> restricted functionality.
> 
> Thanks
> Vivek
> 

>From an attestation perspective, it would be better to add a new hook to
measure the kernel image and append the measurement to the IMA
measurement list.  With the new hook, the integrity of the kernel image
could be enforced.   I assume you realize that calculating a hash
requires reading the entire file.

thanks,

Mimi

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