Message-ID: <CALcN6mh+T0yPhyRgZu4bYBLvAtacU06+N37hXLs=i2PVvGg+mg@mail.gmail.com>
Date:   Wed, 18 Jan 2017 13:03:43 -0800
From:   David Carrillo-Cisneros <davidcc@...gle.com>
To:     Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de>
Cc:     Shivappa Vikas <vikas.shivappa@...el.com>,
        Vikas Shivappa <vikas.shivappa@...ux.intel.com>,
        Stephane Eranian <eranian@...gle.com>,
        linux-kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
        x86 <x86@...nel.org>, hpa@...or.com,
        Ingo Molnar <mingo@...nel.org>,
        Peter Zijlstra <peterz@...radead.org>,
        "Shankar, Ravi V" <ravi.v.shankar@...el.com>,
        "Luck, Tony" <tony.luck@...el.com>,
        Fenghua Yu <fenghua.yu@...el.com>, andi.kleen@...el.com,
        "H. Peter Anvin" <h.peter.anvin@...el.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 00/12] Cqm2: Intel Cache quality monitoring fixes

On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 12:53 AM, Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de> wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2017, Shivappa Vikas wrote:
>> On Tue, 17 Jan 2017, Thomas Gleixner wrote:
>> > On Fri, 6 Jan 2017, Vikas Shivappa wrote:
>> > > - Issue(1): Inaccurate data for per package data, systemwide. Just prints
>> > > zeros or arbitrary numbers.
>> > >
>> > > Fix: Patches fix this by just throwing an error if the mode is not
>> > > supported.
>> > > The modes supported is task monitoring and cgroup monitoring.
>> > > Also the per package
>> > > data for say socket x is returned with the -C <cpu on socketx> -G cgrpy
>> > > option.
>> > > The systemwide data can be looked up by monitoring root cgroup.
>> >
>> > Fine. That just lacks any comment in the implementation. Otherwise I would
>> > not have asked the question about cpu monitoring. Though I fundamentaly
>> > hate the idea of requiring cgroups for this to work.
>> >
>> > If I just want to look at CPU X why on earth do I have to set up all that
>> > cgroup muck? Just because your main focus is cgroups?
>>
>> The upstream per cpu data is broken because its not overriding the other task
>> event RMIDs on that cpu with the cpu event RMID.
>>
>> Can be fixed by adding a percpu struct to hold the RMID thats affinitized
>> to the cpu, however then we miss all the task llc_occupancy in that - still
>> evaluating it.
>
> The point here is that CQM is closely connected to the cache allocation
> technology. After a lengthy discussion we ended up having
>
>   - per cpu CLOSID
>   - per task CLOSID
>
> where all tasks which do not have a CLOSID assigned use the CLOSID which is
> assigned to the CPU they are running on.
>
> So if I configure a system by simply partitioning the cache per cpu, which
> is the proper way to do it for HPC and RT usecases where workloads are
> partitioned on CPUs as well, then I really want to have an equaly simple
> way to monitor the occupancy for that reservation.
>
> And looking at that from the CAT point of view, which is the proper way to
> do it, makes it obvious that CQM should be modeled to match CAT.
>
> So lets assume the following:
>
>    CPU 0-3     default CLOSID 0
>    CPU 4               CLOSID 1
>    CPU 5               CLOSID 2
>    CPU 6               CLOSID 3
>    CPU 7               CLOSID 3
>
>    T1                  CLOSID 4
>    T2                  CLOSID 5
>    T3                  CLOSID 6
>    T4                  CLOSID 6
>
>    All other tasks use the per cpu defaults, i.e. the CLOSID of the CPU
>    they run on.
>
> then the obvious basic monitoring requirement is to have a RMID for each
> CLOSID.

There are use cases where the RMID to CLOSID mapping is not that simple.
Some of them are:
1. Fine-tuning of cache allocation. We may want to have a CLOSID for a thread
during phases that initialize relevant data, while changing it to another during
phases that pollute cache. Yet, we want the RMID to remain the same.

A different variation is to change CLOSID to increase/decrease the size of the
allocated cache when high/low contention is detected.

2. Contention detection. I start with:
   - T1 has RMID 1.
   - T1 changes RMID to 2.
 will expect llc_occupancy(1) to decrease while llc_occupancy(2) increases.
The rate of change will be relative to the level of cache contention present
at the time. This all happens without changing the CLOSID.

>
> So when I monitor CPU4, i.e. CLOSID 1 and T1 runs on CPU4, then I do not
> care at all about the occupancy of T1 simply because that is running on a
> seperate reservation.

It is not useless for scenarios where CLOSID and RMIDs change dynamically
See above.

> Trying to make that an aggregated value in the first
> place is completely wrong. If you want an aggregate, which is pretty much
> useless, then user space tools can generate it easily.

Not useless, see above.

Having user space tools to aggregate implies wasting some of the already
scarce RMIDs.

>
> The whole approach you and David have taken is to whack some desired cgroup
> functionality and whatever into CQM without rethinking the overall
> design. And that's fundamentaly broken because it does not take cache (and
> memory bandwidth) allocation into account.

Monitoring and allocation are closely related yet independent.

I see the advantages of allowing a per-cpu RMID as you describe in the example.

Yet, RMIDs and CLOSIDs should remain independent to allow use cases beyond
one simply monitoring occupancy per allocation.

>
> I seriously doubt, that the existing CQM/MBM code can be refactored in any
> useful way. As Peter Zijlstra said before: Remove the existing cruft
> completely and start with completely new design from scratch.
>
> And this new design should start from the allocation angle and then add the
> whole other muck on top so far its possible. Allocation related monitoring
> must be the primary focus, everything else is just tinkering.

Assuming that my stated need for more than one RMID per CLOSID or more
than one CLOSID per RMID is recognized, what would be the advantage of
starting the design of monitoring from the allocation perspective?

It's quite doable to create a new version of CQM/CMT without all the
cgroup murk.
We can also create an easy way to open events to monitor CLOSIDs. Yet,
I don't see
the advantage of dissociating monitoring from perf and directly
building in on top of
allocation without the assumption of 1 CLOSID : 1 RMID.

Thanks,
David

>
> Thanks,
>
>         tglx
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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