Message-Id: <3c3d8594-9958-5f53-ec0b-f33c36967f95@linux.vnet.ibm.com>
Date:   Thu, 27 Jul 2017 13:49:36 -0400
From:   Stefan Berger <stefanb@...ux.vnet.ibm.com>
To:     "Magalhaes, Guilherme (Brazil R&D-CL)" <guilherme.magalhaes@....com>,
        Mimi Zohar <zohar@...ux.vnet.ibm.com>,
        "Serge E. Hallyn" <serge@...lyn.com>
Cc:     Mehmet Kayaalp <mkayaalp@...binghamton.edu>,
        Yuqiong Sun <sunyuqiong1988@...il.com>,
        containers <containers@...ts.linux-foundation.org>,
        linux-kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
        David Safford <david.safford@...com>,
        James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@...senPartnership.com>,
        linux-security-module <linux-security-module@...r.kernel.org>,
        ima-devel <linux-ima-devel@...ts.sourceforge.net>,
        Yuqiong Sun <suny@...ibm.com>
Subject: Re: [Linux-ima-devel] [RFC PATCH 1/5] ima: extend clone() with IMA
 namespace support

On 07/27/2017 01:18 PM, Magalhaes, Guilherme (Brazil R&D-CL) wrote:
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mimi Zohar [mailto:zohar@...ux.vnet.ibm.com]
>> Sent: quinta-feira, 27 de julho de 2017 11:39
>> To: Magalhaes, Guilherme (Brazil R&D-CL)
>> <guilherme.magalhaes@....com>; Serge E. Hallyn <serge@...lyn.com>
>> Cc: Mehmet Kayaalp <mkayaalp@...binghamton.edu>; Yuqiong Sun
>> <sunyuqiong1988@...il.com>; containers <containers@...ts.linux-
>> foundation.org>; linux-kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>; David Safford
>> <david.safford@...com>; James Bottomley
>> <James.Bottomley@...senPartnership.com>; linux-security-module <linux-
>> security-module@...r.kernel.org>; ima-devel <linux-ima-
>> devel@...ts.sourceforge.net>; Yuqiong Sun <suny@...ibm.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Linux-ima-devel] [RFC PATCH 1/5] ima: extend clone() with IMA
>> namespace support
>>
>> On Thu, 2017-07-27 at 12:51 +0000, Magalhaes, Guilherme (Brazil R&D-
>> CL) wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 2017-07-25 at 16:08 -0500, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, Jul 25, 2017 at 04:57:57PM -0400, Mimi Zohar wrote:
>>>>>> On Tue, 2017-07-25 at 15:46 -0500, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 25, 2017 at 04:11:29PM -0400, Stefan Berger wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 07/25/2017 03:48 PM, Mimi Zohar wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 2017-07-25 at 12:08 -0700, James Bottomley wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 2017-07-25 at 14:04 -0500, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 25, 2017 at 11:49:14AM -0700, James Bottomley
>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 2017-07-25 at 12:53 -0500, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 20, 2017 at 06:50:29PM -0400, Mehmet Kayaalp
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Yuqiong Sun <suny@...ibm.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Add new CONFIG_IMA_NS config option.  Let clone() create
>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new IMA namespace upon CLONE_NEWNS flag. Add
>> ima_ns
>>>> data
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> structure in nsproxy. ima_ns is allocated and freed upon
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IMA namespace creation and exit. Currently, the ima_ns
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contains no useful IMA data but only a dummy interface.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This patch creates the framework for namespacing the
>>>> different aspects of IMA (eg.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IMA-audit, IMA-measurement, IMA-appraisal).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Signed-off-by: Yuqiong Sun <suny@...ibm.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Changelog:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Use CLONE_NEWNS instead of a new CLONE_NEWIMA
>> flag
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> So this means that every mount namespace clone will clone
>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> new IMA namespace.  Is that really ok?
>>>>>>>>>>>> Based on what: space concerns (struct ima_ns is reasonably
>>>> small)?
>>>>>>>>>>>> or whether tying it to the mount namespace is the correct
>>>>>>>>>>>> thing to do.  On
>>>>>>>>>>> Mostly the latter.  The other would be not so much space
>>>>>>>>>>> concerns as time concerns.  Many things use new mounts
>>>>>>>>>>> namespaces, and we wouldn't want multiple IMA calls on all
>>>>>>>>>>> file accesses by all of those.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> the latter, it does seem that this should be a property of
>>>>>>>>>>>> either the mount or user ns rather than its own separate ns.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I could see a use where even a container might want multiple
>>>>>>>>>>>> ima keyrings within the container (say containerised apache
>>>>>>>>>>>> service with multiple tenants), so instinct tells me that
>>>>>>>>>>>> mount ns is the correct granularity for this.
>>>>>>>>>>> I wonder whether we could use echo 1 >
>>>>>>>>>>> /sys/kernel/security/ima/newns as the trigger for requesting
>>>>>>>>>>> a new ima ns on the next clone(CLONE_NEWNS).
>>>>>>>>>> I could go with that, but what about the trigger being
>>>>>>>>>> installing or updating the keyring?  That's the only operation
>>>>>>>>>> that needs namespace separation, so on mount ns clone, you
>> get
>>>>>>>>>> a pointer to the old ima_ns until you do something that
>>>>>>>>>> requires a new key, which then triggers the copy of the
>> namespace
>>>> and installing it?
>>>>>>>>> It isn't just the keyrings that need to be namespaced, but the
>>>>>>>>> measurement list and policy as well.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> IMA-measurement, IMA-appraisal and IMA-audit are all policy
>>>> based.
>>>>>>>>> As soon as the namespace starts, measurements should be
>> added
>>>>>>>>> to the namespace specific measurement list, not it's parent.
>>>>>>> Shouldn't it be both?
>>>>>> The policy defines which files are measured.  The namespace policy
>>>>>> could be different than it's parent's policy, and the parent's
>>>>>> policy could be different than the native policy.  Basically, file
>>>>>> measurements need to be added to the namespace measurement
>> list,
>>>>>> recursively, up to the native measurement list.
>>>>> Yes, but if a task t1 is in namespace ns2 which is a child of
>>>>> namespace ns1, and it accesses a file which ns1's policy says must be
>>>>> measured, then will ns1's required measurement happen (and be
>>>> appended
>>>>> to the ns1 measurement list), whether or not ns2's policy requires it?
>>>> Yes, as the file needs to be measured only in the ns1 policy, the
>>>> measurement would exist in the ns1 measurement list, but not in the
>>>> ns2 measurement list.  The pseudo code snippet below might help.
>>> This algorithm is potentially extending a PCR in TPM multiple times
>>> for a single file event under a given namespace and duplicating
>>> entries. Any concerns with performance and memory footprint?
>> Going forward we assume associated with each container will be a vTPM.
>> The namespace measurements will extend a vTPM.  As the container comes
>> and goes the associated measurement list, keyring, and vTPM will come
>> and go as well.  For this reason, based on policy, the same file
>> measurement might appear in multiple measurement lists.
> My concern is that the base of namespacing the measurement lists is on the
> integration of containers with vTPM. Associating vTPM with containers as
> they are today is not a simple integration since vTPM requires a VM and
> containers do not.

There's a vTPM proxy driver in the kernel that enables spawning a 
frontend /dev/tpm%d and an anonymous backend file descriptor where a 
vTPM can listen on for TPM commands. I integrated this with 'swtpm' and 
I have been working on integrating this into runc. Currently each 
container started with runc can get one (or multiple) vTPMs and 
/dev/tpm0 [and /dev/tpmrm0 in case of TPM2] then appear inside the 
container.

What is missing for integration with IMA namespacing are patches for:

1) IMA to use a tpm_chip to talk to rather than issue TPM commands with 
TPM_ANY_NUM as parameter to TPM driver functions
2) an ioctl for the vtpm proxy driver to attach a vtpm proxy instance's 
tpm_chip to an IMA namespace; this ioctl should be called after the 
creation of the IMA namespace (by container mgmt. stack [runc])
3) - some way for the IMA namespace to release the vTPM proxy's 
'tpm_chip' and other resources once the IMA namespace is deleted

I have these patches in some form and would post them at a later stage 
of namespacing IMA.

swtpm: https://github.com/stefanberger/swtpm
libtpms: https://github.com/stefanberger/libtpms
runc pull request: https://github.com/opencontainers/runc/pull/1082

     Stefan

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