Message-ID: <CAGM2rearx+sGh5pHzy4m-2y3izpQvVotyySt6Raam4L5Zmz5iQ@mail.gmail.com>
Date:   Sat, 23 Jun 2018 22:43:11 -0400
From:   Pavel Tatashin <pasha.tatashin@...cle.com>
To:     tglx@...utronix.de
Cc:     Steven Sistare <steven.sistare@...cle.com>,
        Daniel Jordan <daniel.m.jordan@...cle.com>,
        linux@...linux.org.uk, schwidefsky@...ibm.com,
        Heiko Carstens <heiko.carstens@...ibm.com>,
        John Stultz <john.stultz@...aro.org>, sboyd@...eaurora.org,
        x86@...nel.org, LKML <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
        mingo@...hat.com, hpa@...or.com, douly.fnst@...fujitsu.com,
        peterz@...radead.org, prarit@...hat.com, feng.tang@...el.com,
        Petr Mladek <pmladek@...e.com>, gnomes@...rguk.ukuu.org.uk,
        linux-s390@...r.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH v12 09/11] x86/tsc: prepare for early sched_clock

Hi Thomas,

Thank you for your feedback. My comments below:

> > As soon as sched_clock() starts output non-zero values, we start
> > output time without correcting the output as it is done in
> > sched_clock_local() where unstable TSC and backward motion are
> > detected. But, since early in boot interrupts are disabled, we cannot
> > really correct invalid time, and therefore must rely on sched_clock()
> > to provide us with a contiguous and sane time.
>
> In early boot the TSC frequency is not changing at all so the whole
> unstable thing is completely irrelevant. And that also applies to backward
> motion. There is no such thing during early boot.

Yes, however, the frequency changes slightly during re-calibration. I
see it every time in my no-kvm qemu VM, and I think even on physical
machine. Now, as you suggest below, I can remove the second
calibration entirely, and keep only the early calibration, I am not
sure what the historical reason to why linux has two of them in the
first place. But, I assumed the later one was more precise because of
some outside reasons, such as different cpu p-state, or something
else.

>
> > In earlier versions of this project, I was solving this problem by
> > adjusting __sched_clock_offset every time sched_clock()'s continuity was
> > changed by using a callback function into sched/clock.c. But, Peter was
> > against that approach.
>
> So your changelog is completely misleading and utterly wrong. What the heck
> has this to do with jiffies and the use_tsc jump label? Exactly nothing.

This output is what happens after: "sched: early sched_clock" but
before"x86/tsc: use tsc early", hence the title of patch: "x86/tsc:
prepare for early sched_clock"
So, before  "x86/tsc: prepare for early sched_clock" we go from
jiffies to real tsc, and thats where the problem happens. I assume
theoretically, the same problem could happen if we can't calibrate TSC
early, but succeed later. Now, this is, however, a moot point, as you
suggest to remove the second calibration.

After thinking about this some more, in the future revision I will
simply switch order for "x86/tsc: use tsc early" to go before  "sched:
early sched_clock", since transitions jiffies -> tsc and tsc ->
jiffies won't be possible with the changes you suggest below.

>
> > [    0.004000] ..TIMER: vector=0x30 apic1=0 pin1=2 apic2=-1 pin2=-1
> > [    0.009000] tsc: Fast TSC calibration using PIT
> > [    0.010000] tsc: Detected 3192.137 MHz processor
> > [    0.011000] clocksource: tsc-early: mask: 0xffffffffffffffff max_cycles: 0x2e03465ceb2,    max_idle_ns: 440795259855 ns
>
> > static_branch_enable(__use_tsc) is called, and timestamps became precise
> > but reduced:
>
> > [    0.002233] Calibrating delay loop (skipped), value calculated using timer frequency..     6384.27 BogoMIPS (lpj=3192137)
>
> This is crap, because this is not what the current implementation does. The
> current implementation enables the static branch when the early TSC sched
> clock is enabled. So even the timestamps are crap because with the early
> sched clock the time stamps are precise _before_ the timer interrupt is
> initialized. That's the whole purpose of the exercise, right?
>
> This made me assume that its an existing problem. Heck, changelogs are
> about facts and not fairy tales. And it's completely non interesting that
> you observed this problem with some random variant of your patches. What's
> interesting is the factual problem which makes the change necessary.

The changelog was about a fact, as stated above: output is from what
happens after "sched: early sched_clock" but before "x86/tsc: use tsc
early", (i.e.  "x86/tsc: use tsc early" might be reverted or
bisected).

>
> So the problem is not the transition from jiffies to early TSC because at
> the point where you enable the early TSC sched clock the jiffies sched
> clock value is exactly ZERO simply because the timer interrupt is not
> running yet.
>
> The problem happens when you switch from the early TSC thing to the real
> one in tsc_init(). And that happens because you reinitialize the cyc2ns
> data of the boot CPU which was already initialized. That sets the offset to
> the current TSC value and voila time goes backwards.
>
> This whole nonsense can be completely avoided.
>
> If you look at the existing tsc_init() then you'll notice that the loop
> which initializes cyc2ns data for each possible cpu is bonkers. It does the
> same stupid thing over and over for every possible CPU, i.e.
>
>       - Set already zeroed data to zero
>
>       - Calculate the cyc2ns conversion values from the same input
>
>       - Invoke sched_clock_idle_sleep/wakeup_event() which executes the
>         same code over and over on the boot cpu and the boot cpu sched
>         clock data.
>
> That's pointless and wants to be fixed in a preparatory step.

I will change the code as you suggest below: I like calibrating only
in one place.

> <rant>
>
> TBH. I'm utterly disappointed how all this was approached.
>
> I absolutely detest the approach of duct taping something new into existing
> code without a proper analysis of the existing infrastructure in the first
> place.

For this particular patch, I politely asked for suggestions in cover letter:

v10-v11
       - I added one more patch:
          "x86/tsc: prepare for early sched_clock" which fixes a problem
          that I discovered while testing. I am not particularly happy with
          the fix, as it adds a new argument that is used only in one
          place, but if you have a suggestion for a different approach on
          how to address this problem please let me know.

The confusion was that I should have been more clear where the problem
is exactly happens, and that is happens before"x86/tsc: use tsc early"
but after"sched: early sched_clock".

 This is just utter waste of time. I don't care about your wasted
> time at all, but I care about the fact, that I had to sit down and do the
> analysis myself and about the time wasted in reviewing half baken
> stuff. Sure, I was able do the analysis rather fast because I'm familiar
> with the code, but I still had to sit down and figure out all the
> details. You might have needed a week for that, but that would have saved
> you several weeks of tinkering and the frustration of getting your patches
> rejected over and over.
>
> Alone the fact that dmesg has this:
>
> [    0.000000] tsc: Fast TSC calibration using PIT
> [    0.020000] tsc: Fast TSC calibration using PIT

I know that TSC is calibrated the same way, but frequency is slightly
different, I was not sure what causes the difference.

>
> should have made you look into exactly what I was looking at just now. It's
> really not rocket science to figure out that both calibrations do
> absolutely the same thing and this is even more hilarious as you are doing
> this to do boot time analysis in order to make the boot faster. Oh well.
>
> </rant>
>
> So I made your homework and expect as compensation a sqeaky clean patch set
> with proper changelogs. I surely might have missed a few details, but I'm
> also sure you find and fix them if you avoid trying to repost the whole
> thing tomorrow. Take your time and do it right and ask questions upfront if
> anything is unclear instead of implementing hacks based on weird
> assumptions.

Again, thank you for your help and review. I will address all the
comment and send out a new series when its ready.

Pavel

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