linux-kernel - Re: [PATCH printk v2 2/5] printk: remove safe buffers

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Message-ID: <87im4zoexd.fsf@jogness.linutronix.de>
Date:   Tue, 06 Apr 2021 13:01:02 +0200
From:   John Ogness <john.ogness@...utronix.de>
To:     Petr Mladek <pmladek@...e.com>
Cc:     Sergey Senozhatsky <sergey.senozhatsky.work@...il.com>,
        Sergey Senozhatsky <sergey.senozhatsky@...il.com>,
        Steven Rostedt <rostedt@...dmis.org>,
        Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de>,
        linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org,
        Michael Ellerman <mpe@...erman.id.au>,
        Benjamin Herrenschmidt <benh@...nel.crashing.org>,
        Paul Mackerras <paulus@...ba.org>,
        Eric Biederman <ebiederm@...ssion.com>,
        Christophe Leroy <christophe.leroy@...roup.eu>,
        Nicholas Piggin <npiggin@...il.com>,
        Alistair Popple <alistair@...ple.id.au>,
        Jordan Niethe <jniethe5@...il.com>,
        Peter Zijlstra <peterz@...radead.org>,
        "Aneesh Kumar K.V" <aneesh.kumar@...ux.ibm.com>,
        Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>,
        Kees Cook <keescook@...omium.org>,
        Tiezhu Yang <yangtiezhu@...ngson.cn>,
        Alexey Kardashevskiy <aik@...abs.ru>,
        Yue Hu <huyue2@...ong.com>, Rafael Aquini <aquini@...hat.com>,
        "Guilherme G. Piccoli" <gpiccoli@...onical.com>,
        "Paul E. McKenney" <paulmck@...nel.org>,
        linuxppc-dev@...ts.ozlabs.org, kexec@...ts.infradead.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH printk v2 2/5] printk: remove safe buffers

On 2021-04-01, Petr Mladek <pmladek@...e.com> wrote:
>> Caller-id solves this problem and is easy to sort for anyone with
>> `grep'. Yes, it is a shame that `dmesg' does not show it, but
>> directly using any of the printk interfaces does show it (kmsg_dump,
>> /dev/kmsg, syslog, console).
>
> True but frankly, the current situation is _far_ from convenient:
>
>    + consoles do not show it by default
>    + none userspace tool (dmesg, journalctl, crash) is able to show it
>    + grep is a nightmare, especially if you have more than handful of CPUs
>
> Yes, everything is solvable but not easily.
>
>> >     I get this with "echo l >/proc/sysrq-trigger" and this patchset:
>> 
>> Of course. Without caller-id, it is a mess. But this has nothing to do
>> with NMI. The same problem exists for WARN_ON() on multiple CPUs
>> simultaneously. If the user is not using caller-id, they are
>> lost. Caller-id is the current solution to the interlaced logs.
>
> Sure. But in reality, the risk of mixed WARN_ONs is small. While
> this patch makes backtraces from all CPUs always unusable without
> caller_id and non-trivial effort.

I would prefer we solve the situation for non-NMI as well, not just for
the sysrq "l" case.

>> For the long term, we should introduce a printk-context API that allows
>> callers to perfectly pack their multi-line output into a single
>> entry. We discussed [0][1] this back in August 2020.
>
> We need a "short" term solution. There are currently 3 solutions:
>
> 1. Keep nmi_safe() and all the hacks around.
>
> 2. Serialize nmi_cpu_backtrace() by a spin lock and later by
>    the special lock used also by atomic consoles.
>
> 3. Tell complaining people how to sort the messed logs.

Or we look into the long term solution now. If caller-id's cannot not be
used as the solution (because nobody turns it on, nobody knows about it,
and/or distros do not enable it), then we should look at how to make at
least the backtraces contiguous. I have a few ideas here.

John Ogness