linux-kernel - Re: [Qestion] Is preempt_disable/enable needed in non-preemption code path

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives
Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.
[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [day] [month] [year] [list]
Message-ID: <b5c91db4-c1b6-3849-d5a9-89ca07d2d020@windriver.com>
Date:   Mon, 19 Apr 2021 12:58:58 +0800
From:   "Xu, Yanfei" <yanfei.xu@...driver.com>
To:     paulmck@...nel.org
Cc:     rcu@...r.kernel.org, LKML <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [Qestion] Is preempt_disable/enable needed in non-preemption code
 path



On 4/17/21 1:26 AM, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
> [Please note: This e-mail is from an EXTERNAL e-mail address]
> 
> On Fri, Apr 16, 2021 at 06:51:10PM +0800, Xu, Yanfei wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 4/16/21 1:07 AM, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
>>> [Please note: This e-mail is from an EXTERNAL e-mail address]
>>>
>>> On Fri, Apr 16, 2021 at 12:18:42AM +0800, Xu, Yanfei wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 4/15/21 11:43 PM, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
>>>>> [Please note: This e-mail is from an EXTERNAL e-mail address]
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 11:04:05PM +0800, Xu, Yanfei wrote:
>>>>>> Hi experts,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am learning rcu mechanism and its codes. When looking at the
>>>>>> rcu_blocking_is_gp(), I found there is a pair preemption disable/enable
>>>>>> operation in non-preemption code path. And it has been a long time. I can't
>>>>>> understand why we need it? Is there some thing I missed? If not, can we
>>>>>> remove the unnecessary operation like blow?
>>>>>
>>>>> Good point, you are right that preemption is disabled anyway in that block
>>>>> of code.  However, preempt_disable() and preempt_enable() also prevent the
>>>>> compiler from moving that READ_ONCE() around.  So my question to you is
>>>>> whether it is safe to remove those statements entirely or whether they
>>>>> should instead be replaced by barrier() or similar.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your reply! :)
>>>>
>>>> Yes, preempt_disable() and preempt_enable() defined in !preemption are
>>>> barrier(). barrier can prevent from reordering that READ_ONCE(), but base on
>>>> my current understanding, volatile in READ_ONCE can also tell the compiler
>>>> not to reorder it. So, I think it's safe?
>>>
>>> Maybe.
>>>
>>> Please keep in mind that although the compiler is prohibited from
>>> reordering volatile accesses with each other, there is nothing stopping
>>> it from reordering volatile accesses with non-volatile accesses.
>>
>> Thanks for your patient explanation!
>>
>> I am trying to absorb what you said. Blow are my understanding:
>> 1. "the compiler is prohibited from reordering volatile accesses with each
>> other" means these situations:
>> int a;
>> foo()
>> {
>>      for(;;)
>>          READ_ONCE(a);
>> }
>>
>> or
>>
>> int a,b;
>> foo()
>> {
>>      int c,d;
>>      c = READ_ONCE(a);
>>      d = READ_ONCE(b);
>> }
> 
> Yes, in both cases the load instructions emitted for the READ_ONCE()
> macros must be emitted in order.  The underlying hardware is free
> to reorder.

Got it.
> 
>> 2. "volatile accesses with non-volatile accesses" means d=b may happen
>> before c=READ_ONCE(a) :
>> int a;
>> foo()
>> {
>>      int b = 2
>>      int c,d;
>>      c = READ_ONCE(a);
>>      d = b;
>> }
>> if we want to keep the ordering of volatile access "c=READ_ONCE(a)" and
>> non-volatile access "d=b", we should use stronger barrier like barrier().
> 
> Or an additional READ_ONCE() for b or a WRITE_ONCE() for d.  But again,
> this would constrain only the compiler, not the hardware.
> 
> But this wouldn't matter in most cases, because both b and d are local
> variables whose addresses were never taken.  So someone would need to
> be using something crazy to poke into others' stacks for this to matter.

Agree.
> 
>> Hope I didn't misunderstand.
> 
> It looks like you have most of it.
> 
>> Back to rcu_blocking_is_gp(), I find this link today
>> https://www.spinics.net/lists/rcu/msg03985.html
>> With the content in this link, I still haven't got the meaning of these two
>> barrier(). I think I should learn knowledge about cpu-hotplug and things
>> which talked in the link first to make sure if I am missing something, and
>> then consult you. :)
> 
> That sounds like a very good approach!
> 
> Keep in mind that I am worried not just about the current state of
> the code and compilers, but also their possible future states.

I see.

Thanks again.

Best regards,
Yanfei
> 
>                                                          Thanx, Paul
> 
>> Best regards,
>> Yanfei
>>
>>>
>>>                                                           Thanx, Paul
>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> Yanfei
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>                                                            Thanx, Paul
>>>>>
>>>>>> diff --git a/kernel/rcu/tree.c b/kernel/rcu/tree.c
>>>>>> index da6f5213fb74..c6d95a00715e 100644
>>>>>> --- a/kernel/rcu/tree.c
>>>>>> +++ b/kernel/rcu/tree.c
>>>>>> @@ -3703,7 +3703,6 @@ static int rcu_blocking_is_gp(void)
>>>>>>            if (IS_ENABLED(CONFIG_PREEMPTION))
>>>>>>                    return rcu_scheduler_active == RCU_SCHEDULER_INACTIVE;
>>>>>>            might_sleep();  /* Check for RCU read-side critical section. */
>>>>>> -       preempt_disable();
>>>>>>            /*
>>>>>>             * If the rcu_state.n_online_cpus counter is equal to one,
>>>>>>             * there is only one CPU, and that CPU sees all prior accesses
>>>>>> @@ -3718,7 +3717,6 @@ static int rcu_blocking_is_gp(void)
>>>>>>             * Those memory barriers are provided by CPU-hotplug code.
>>>>>>             */
>>>>>>            ret = READ_ONCE(rcu_state.n_online_cpus) <= 1;
>>>>>> -       preempt_enable();
>>>>>>            return ret;
>>>>>>     }
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>> Yanfei