linux-kernel - Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/3] DynamicHZ: Configuring the timer tick rate at boot time

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Message-ID: <20250210165434.0d594c87@pumpkin>
Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2025 16:54:34 +0000
From: David Laight <david.laight.linux@...il.com>
To: Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de>
Cc: John Stultz <jstultz@...gle.com>, LKML <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
 Anna-Maria Behnsen <anna-maria@...utronix.de>, Frederic Weisbecker
 <frederic@...nel.org>, Ingo Molnar <mingo@...nel.org>, Peter Zijlstra
 <peterz@...radead.org>, Juri Lelli <juri.lelli@...hat.com>, Vincent Guittot
 <vincent.guittot@...aro.org>, Dietmar Eggemann <dietmar.eggemann@....com>,
 Steven Rostedt <rostedt@...dmis.org>, Ben Segall <bsegall@...gle.com>, Mel
 Gorman <mgorman@...e.de>, Valentin Schneider <vschneid@...hat.com>, Stephen
 Boyd <sboyd@...nel.org>, Yury Norov <yury.norov@...il.com>, Bitao Hu
 <yaoma@...ux.alibaba.com>, Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>,
 kernel-team@...roid.com, Saravana Kannan <saravanak@...gle.com>, Samuel Wu
 <wusamuel@...gle.com>, Qais Yousef <qyousef@...gle.com>
Subject: Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/3] DynamicHZ: Configuring the timer tick rate at
 boot time

On Wed, 29 Jan 2025 09:09:02 +0100
Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de> wrote:

> On Tue, Jan 28 2025 at 22:10, John Stultz wrote:
> > On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 8:46 AM Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de> wrote:  
> >>   1) Jiffies and related timer wheel interfaces
> >>
> >>      jiffies should just go away completely and be replaced by a simple
> >>      millisecond counter, which is accessible in the same way as
> >>      jiffies today.
> >>
> >>      That removes the bulk of HZ usage all over the place and makes the
> >>      usage sites simpler as the interfaces just use SI units and the
> >>      gazillions (~4500 to jiffies and ~1000 from jiffies) back and
> >>      forth conversions just go away.  
> >
> > Yeah, this was basically where I was hoping this would allow us to go.
> > I was imagining once dyn_hz was possible, we could basically fix HZ to
> > 1000 internally, leaving jiffies as that 1ms counter, and let the
> > actual interrupt rate be set via the dynhz default config value.  Then
> > iterating through all the code switching HZ usage to MSEC_PER_SEC, etc
> > would be possible.  
> 
> I strongly suggest to start with exactly this because it significantly
> reduces the problem space and has a valuable benefit in general.

I doubt anyone will notice if a 250Hz timer interrupt always adds 4 to 'jiffies'.

One problem with increasing the frequency of the interrupt is the sheer amount
of code that runs every timer tick.
I suspect most of it is in the scheduler!

Do I recall that the timer wheels no longer move long timers onto the high
resolution wheels?
So longer timers are a much increased granularity.
That is going to be made worse for anyone currently using a 250Hz 'tick'.

Making 'jiffies' milliseconds does stop you having a faster timer tick.
I know one architecture kernel (might not have been Linux) defaulted to 1024Hz.
But I'm not sure that is a problem.

32bit systems must be able to handle wrap - we all know (to our cost) that
a 1ms counter wraps in 48 days. So even a 4ms one wraps quite often.
Although having a 64bit (long) counter in 64bit mode really just hides bugs.

	David