linux-kernel - Re: [RFC PATCH 13/15] iommufd: Persist iommu domains for live update

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Message-ID: <20251002211217.GI3195829@ziepe.ca>
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2025 18:12:17 -0300
From: Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@...pe.ca>
To: Samiullah Khawaja <skhawaja@...gle.com>
Cc: Pasha Tatashin <pasha.tatashin@...een.com>,
	David Woodhouse <dwmw2@...radead.org>,
	Lu Baolu <baolu.lu@...ux.intel.com>, Joerg Roedel <joro@...tes.org>,
	Will Deacon <will@...nel.org>, iommu@...ts.linux.dev,
	YiFei Zhu <zhuyifei@...gle.com>,
	Robin Murphy <robin.murphy@....com>,
	Pratyush Yadav <pratyush@...nel.org>,
	Kevin Tian <kevin.tian@...el.com>, linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org,
	Saeed Mahameed <saeedm@...dia.com>,
	Adithya Jayachandran <ajayachandra@...dia.com>,
	Parav Pandit <parav@...dia.com>,
	Leon Romanovsky <leonro@...dia.com>, William Tu <witu@...dia.com>,
	Vipin Sharma <vipinsh@...gle.com>, dmatlack@...gle.com,
	Chris Li <chrisl@...nel.org>, praan@...gle.com
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 13/15] iommufd: Persist iommu domains for live update

On Thu, Oct 02, 2025 at 12:29:25PM -0700, Samiullah Khawaja wrote:
> I had a quick discussion with Pasha to see how LUO can help with FD
> dependencies and FINISH order. Perhaps we need a new LUO API that
> iommufd can call before live update, explicitly telling LUO that it
> depends on an FD that is going to be preserved.

Keeping track of a dependency graph is possible.

But I wonder if it is really needed to be fine grained.

If a memfd remains frozen until finish, and finish can't happen until
all luo objects that are internally refering to outside memory
indicate they are done, don't we get the same outcome?

Is there a reason a specific memfd should be unfrozen before finish?

Maybe finish is too broad grained? What if each session had a finish?
All the objects in the session are cleaned up, invoke the session
finish and the memfd's in the session unfreeze?

Otherwise to build a dependency graph we'd need things like
iommu_domain to record all the memfds/etc stored within it and
preserve that and so on. This information has to come from the IOAS in
iommfd so it is quite a bit more weirdness to inject.

Whereas if we have the preserving iommufd do a sequence where it
pushes all the ioas pages (memfd/etc) to luo, and only then permits
the hwpt to be preserved to the same session, we get the same basic
tracking without needing to store a graph.

Donno...

Jason