netdev - Re: [Devel] Re: Network virtualization/isolation

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Message-ID: <20061209035002.GA11747@MAIL.13thfloor.at>
Date:	Sat, 9 Dec 2006 04:50:02 +0100
From:	Herbert Poetzl <herbert@...hfloor.at>
To:	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@...ssion.com>
Cc:	Kirill Korotaev <dev@...ru>,
	Linux Containers <containers@...ts.osdl.org>,
	Dmitry Mishin <dim@...nvz.org>, netdev@...r.kernel.org,
	hadi@...erus.ca, Stephen Hemminger <shemminger@...l.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@...l.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@...l.org>
Subject: Re: [Devel] Re: Network virtualization/isolation

On Fri, Dec 08, 2006 at 12:57:49PM -0700, Eric W. Biederman wrote:
> Herbert Poetzl <herbert@...hfloor.at> writes:
> 
> >> But, ok, it is not the real point to argue so much imho 
> >> and waste our time instead of doing things.

> > well, IMHO better talk (and think) first, then implement
> > something ... not the other way round, and then start
> > fixing up the mess ...
> 
> Well we need a bit of both.

hmm, are 'we' in a hurry here?

until recently, 'Linux' (mainline) didn't even want
to hear about OS Level virtualization, now there
is a rush to quickly get 'something' in, not knowing
or caring if it is usable at all?

I think there are a lot of 'potential users' for
this kind of virtualization, and so 'we' can test
almost all aspects outside of mainline, and once
we know the stuff works as expected, then we can
integrate it ...

the UTS namespace was something 'we all' had already
implemented in this (or a very similar) way, and in
one or two interations, it should actually work as 
expected. nevertheless, it was one of the simplest
spaces ...

we do not yet know the details for the IPC namespace,
as IPC is not that easy to check as UTS, and 'we'
haven't gotten real world feedback on that yet ...

so personally I think we should start some serious
testing on the upcoming namespaces, and we should
continue discussing the various approaches, until
'we' can agree on the (almost) 'perfect' solution

> This is thankfully not exported to user space, so as long 
> as our implementation is correct it doesn't much matter.

that's something I do not really agree with, stuff
integrated into the kernel should be well designed
and it should be tested ...

best,
Herbert

> I do agree with the point that context may make sense. 
> I have yet to be convinced though.
> 
> Eric
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