netdev - Re: Reporting bugs and bisection

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Message-Id: <20080414.034116.24468363.davem@davemloft.net>
Date:	Mon, 14 Apr 2008 03:41:16 -0700 (PDT)
From:	David Miller <davem@...emloft.net>
To:	akpm@...ux-foundation.org
Cc:	viro@...IV.linux.org.uk, w@....eu, david@...g.hm,
	sclark46@...thlink.net, johnpol@....mipt.ru, rjw@...k.pl,
	tilman@...p.cc, Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu, lkml@....ca,
	jesper.juhl@...il.com, yoshfuji@...ux-ipv6.org, jeff@...zik.org,
	linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org, git@...r.kernel.org,
	netdev@...r.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Reporting bugs and bisection

From: Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 03:15:30 -0700

> You carefully deleted my text so that you could misquote it, thereby
> flagrantly misrepresenting everything I said.

Not the intention, but anyways:

> Here it is again:
> 
> : The steps to be taken are:
> : 
> : a) agree that we have a problem
> : 
> : b) agree that we need to address it
> : 
> : c) identify the day-to-day work practices which will help address it (as
> :    you have done)
> : 
> : d) identify the process changes which will force us to adopt those practices
> : 
> : e) implement those process changes.
> 
> Forcing a discipline upon oneself is totally different from having it
> forced upon you by someone else.
> 
> Each step will need general agreement and buyin, otherwise none of it will
> (or should) work.

The "force" is to "us" which is a group.

And I imagine that newcomers will be expected to adopt these
"practices".  So in effect, they will be "forced" into the process
changes as well.

I'm getting more and more sensitive to issues on this level over time,
because I realize that the fundamental issue in all human group issues
is getting people to "want" to do things.  And "force", in any form,
tends to be incompatible with "want".  And in particular, people will
often even shun things they "want" when it is "forced" to them.

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