netdev - Re: Reporting bugs and bisection

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Message-ID: <4805F402.1020603@earthlink.net>
Date:	Wed, 16 Apr 2008 08:41:38 -0400
From:	Stephen Clark <sclark46@...thlink.net>
To:	david@...g.hm
CC:	David Newall <davidn@...idnewall.com>,
	"Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw@...k.pl>,
	Michael Kerrisk <mtk.manpages@...il.com>,
	James Morris <jmorris@...ei.org>,
	Al Viro <viro@...iv.linux.org.uk>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>,
	Willy Tarreau <w@....eu>,
	Evgeniy Polyakov <johnpol@....mipt.ru>,
	Tilman Schmidt <tilman@...p.cc>, Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu,
	Mark Lord <lkml@....ca>, David Miller <davem@...emloft.net>,
	jesper.juhl@...il.com, yoshfuji@...ux-ipv6.org, jeff@...zik.org,
	linux-kernel <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>, git@...r.kernel.org,
	netdev@...r.kernel.org
Subject: Re: Reporting bugs and bisection

david@...g.hm wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Apr 2008, David Newall wrote:
> 
>> Rafael J. Wysocki wrote:
>>> Well, even if someone introduces bugs relatively frequently, but then 
>>> also
>>> works with the reporters and fixes the bugs timely, it's about okay IMO.
>>>
>> This really is not okay.  Even if bugs are fixed a version or two later,
>> the impact those bugs have on users makes the system look bad and drives
>> them away.  We do not, I believe, want Linux to top the list for "most
>> bugs".  It's unprofessional, unreliable and quite undesirable.
> 
> timely frequently means the code was merged in -rc1/2 and was fixed 
> before the final release of the same version.
> 
> given the huge variety of hardware and workloads, it's just too easy for 
> there to be cases where any trade-off you make (code size, performance, 
> memory usage, common case definitions) can turn around and bite you. In 
> addition frequently hardware doesn't work quite the way the design specs 
> say that it should (completely ignoring the fact that many drivers are 
> reverse engineered). what's most important is that when a case shows up 
> it gets addressed promptly
> 
> I'd rather have a developer/maintainer who introduces and fixed 100 bug, 
> but fixes them promptly, as opposed to one who only introduces one bug, 
> but refuses to consider fixing the code 'because they don't make 
> mistakes like that' (u.sadly a common attitude from people who produce 
> very good code much of the time)
> 
> best of all is a developer/maintainer who writes very good code and is 
> willing to accept the fact that they make mistakes and fixes the code 
> promptly, but those people are extremely rare, and usually they emerge 
> from the pool of people who make more mistakes and fix them promptly, 
> which is an added reason I'm more tolerant of that group.
> 
> David Lang
> 
Having been a Linux user since the late 90's the problem I see is that
developers decide to re-design stuff that is already working and then things
that used to work don't work anymore.

Libata is a good example. I had an older laptop that eventually got working
again - but the old ide stuff wasn't studied enough to find out what had to be
brought forward and supported in libata.

Regards,
Steve
-- 

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain temporary safety,
deserve neither liberty nor safety."  (Ben Franklin)

"The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty
decreases."  (Thomas Jefferson)


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