netdev - Re: question about softirqs

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Date:	Tue, 12 May 2009 11:12:58 +0200
From:	Peter Zijlstra <a.p.zijlstra@...llo.nl>
To:	Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu>
Cc:	Chris Friesen <cfriesen@...tel.com>,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt@...dmis.org>,
	David Miller <davem@...emloft.net>, linuxppc-dev@...abs.org,
	paulus@...ba.org, netdev@...r.kernel.org
Subject: Re: question about softirqs

On Tue, 2009-05-12 at 10:12 +0200, Ingo Molnar wrote:
> * Chris Friesen <cfriesen@...tel.com> wrote:
> 
> > This started out as a thread on the ppc list, but on the 
> > suggestion of DaveM and Paul Mackerras I'm expanding the receiver 
> > list a bit.
> > 
> > Currently, if a softirq is raised in process context the 
> > TIF_RESCHED_PENDING flag gets set and on return to userspace we 
> > run the scheduler, expecting it to switch to ksoftirqd to handle 
> > the softirqd processing.
> > 
> > I think I see a possible problem with this. Suppose I have a 
> > SCHED_FIFO task spinning on recvmsg() with MSG_DONTWAIT set. Under 
> > the scenario above, schedule() would re-run the spinning task 
> > rather than ksoftirqd, thus preventing any incoming packets from 
> > being sent up the stack until we get a real hardware 
> > interrupt--which could be a whole jiffy if interrupt mitigation is 
> > enabled in the net device.
> 
> TIF_RESCHED_PENDING will not be set if a SCHED_FIFO task wakes up a 
> SCHED_OTHER ksoftirqd task. But starvation of ksoftirqd processing 
> will occur.
> 
> > DaveM pointed out that if we're doing transmits we're likely to 
> > hit local_bh_enable(), which would process the softirq work.  
> > However, I think we may still have a problem in the above rx-only 
> > scenario--or is it too contrived to matter?
> 
> This could occur, and the problem is really that task priorities do 
> not extend across softirq work processing.
> 
> This could occur in ordinary SCHED_OTHER tasks as well, if the 
> softirq is bounced to ksoftirqd - which it only should be if there's 
> serious softirq overload - or, as you describe it above, if the 
> softirq is raised in process context:
> 
>         if (!in_interrupt())
>                 wakeup_softirqd();
> 
> that's not really clean. We look into eliminating process context 
> use of raise_softirq_irqsoff(). Such code sequence:
> 
> 	local_irq_save(flags);
> 	...
> 	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
> 	...
> 	local_irq_restore(flags);
> 
> should be converted to something like:
> 
> 	local_irq_save(flags);
> 	...
> 	raise_softirq_irqsoff(nr);
> 	...
> 	local_irq_restore(flags);
> 	recheck_softirqs();
> 
> If someone does not do proper local_bh_disable()/enable() sequences 
> for micro-optimization reasons, then push the check to after the 
> critcal section - and dont cause extra reschedules by waking up 
> ksoftirqd. raise_softirq_irqsoff() will also be faster.


Wouldn't the even better solution be to get rid of softirqs
all-together?

I see the recent work by Thomas to get threaded interrupts upstream as a
good first step towards that goal, once the RX processing is moved to a
thread (or multiple threads) one can priorize them in the regular
sys_sched_setscheduler() way and its obvious that a FIFO task above the
priority of the network tasks will have network starvation issues.



--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe netdev" in
the body of a message to majordomo@...r.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html