netdev - Re: [GIT PULL] AlacrityVM guest drivers for 2.6.33

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite: Windows password security audit tool. GUI, reports in PDF.

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Date:	Wed, 23 Dec 2009 20:27:05 +0100
From:	Andi Kleen <andi@...stfloor.org>
To:	Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu>
Cc:	Anthony Liguori <anthony@...emonkey.ws>,
	Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz <bzolnier@...il.com>,
	Gregory Haskins <gregory.haskins@...il.com>,
	Avi Kivity <avi@...hat.com>, kvm@...r.kernel.org,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@...ux-foundation.org>,
	torvalds@...ux-foundation.org,
	"linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	netdev@...r.kernel.org,
	"alacrityvm-devel@...ts.sourceforge.net" 
	<alacrityvm-devel@...ts.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [GIT PULL] AlacrityVM guest drivers for 2.6.33

Ingo Molnar <mingo@...e.hu> writes:

> Yes, there's (obviously) compatibility requirements and artifacts and past 
> mistakes (as with any software interface), but you need to admit it to 

Yes that's exactly what I meant. 

> yourself that your "virtualization is sloppy just like hardware" claim is just 

In my experience hardware is a lot less sloppy than software.
Imagine your latest CPU had as many regressions as 2.6.32 @)

I wish software and even VMs were as good.

> a cheap excuse to not do a proper job of interface engineering.

Past mistakes cannot be easily fixed. And undoubtedly even the new
shiny interfaces will have bugs and problems. Also the behaviour is
often not completely understood. Maybe it can be easier debugged with
fully available source, but even then it's hard to fix the old
software (or rather even if you can fix it deploy the fixes). In
that regard it's a lot like hardware.

I agree with you that this makes it important to design good
interfaces, but again realistically mistakes will be made
and they cannot be all fixed retroactively.

-Andi

-- 
ak@...ux.intel.com -- Speaking for myself only.
--
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe netdev" in
the body of a message to majordomo@...r.kernel.org
More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html