netdev - Re: [RFC v2 2/4] net: enables interface option to skip IP

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Date:	Wed, 19 Feb 2014 19:13:08 +0000
From:	Zoltan Kiss <zoltan.kiss@...rix.com>
To:	"Luis R. Rodriguez" <mcgrof@...not-panic.com>,
	Dan Williams <dcbw@...hat.com>
CC:	"netdev@...r.kernel.org" <netdev@...r.kernel.org>,
	<xen-devel@...ts.xenproject.org>, <kvm@...r.kernel.org>,
	"linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	"David S. Miller" <davem@...emloft.net>,
	Alexey Kuznetsov <kuznet@....inr.ac.ru>,
	James Morris <jmorris@...ei.org>,
	Hideaki YOSHIFUJI <yoshfuji@...ux-ipv6.org>,
	Patrick McHardy <kaber@...sh.net>
Subject: Re: [RFC v2 2/4] net: enables interface option to skip IP

On 19/02/14 17:20, Luis R. Rodriguez wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 8:45 AM, Dan Williams <dcbw@...hat.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 2014-02-18 at 13:19 -0800, Luis R. Rodriguez wrote:
>>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 12:23 PM, Dan Williams <dcbw@...hat.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 2014-02-14 at 18:59 -0800, Luis R. Rodriguez wrote:
>>>>> From: "Luis R. Rodriguez" <mcgrof@...e.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> Some interfaces do not need to have any IPv4 or IPv6
>>>>> addresses, so enable an option to specify this. One
>>>>> example where this is observed are virtualization
>>>>> backend interfaces which just use the net_device
>>>>> constructs to help with their respective frontends.
>>>>>
>>>>> This should optimize boot time and complexity on
>>>>> virtualization environments for each backend interface
>>>>> while also avoiding triggering SLAAC and DAD, which is
>>>>> simply pointless for these type of interfaces.
>>>>
>>>> Would it not be better/cleaner to use disable_ipv6 and then add a
>>>> disable_ipv4 sysctl, then use those with that interface?
>>>
>>> Sure, but note that the both disable_ipv6 and accept_dada sysctl
>>> parameters are global. ipv4 and ipv6 interfaces are created upon
>>> NETDEVICE_REGISTER, which will get triggered when a driver calls
>>> register_netdev(). The goal of this patch was to enable an early
>>> optimization for drivers that have no need ever for ipv4 or ipv6
>>> interfaces.
>>
>> Each interface gets override sysctls too though, eg:
>>
>> /proc/sys/net/ipv6/conf/enp0s25/disable_ipv6
>
> I hadn't seen those, thanks!
>
>> which is the one I meant; you're obviously right that the global ones
>> aren't what you want here.  But the specific ones should be suitable?
>
> Under the approach Stephen mentioned by first ensuring the interface
> is down yes. There's one use case I can consider to still want the
> patch though, more on that below.
>
>> If you set that on a per-interface basis, then you'll get EPERM or
>> something whenever you try to add IPv6 addresses or do IPv6 routing.
>
> Neat, thanks.
>
>>> Zoltan has noted though some use cases of IPv4 or IPv6 addresses on
>>> backends though, as such this is no longer applicable as a
>>> requirement. The ipv4 sysctl however still seems like a reasonable
>>> approach to enable optimizations of the network in topologies where
>>> its known we won't need them but -- we'd need to consider a much more
>>> granular solution, not just global as it is now for disable_ipv6, and
>>> we'd also have to figure out a clean way to do this to not incur the
>>> cost of early address interface addition upon register_netdev().
>>>
>>> Given that we have a use case for ipv4 and ipv6 addresses on
>>> xen-netback we no longer have an immediate use case for such early
>>> optimization primitives though, so I'll drop this.
>>>
>>>> The IFF_SKIP_IP seems to duplicate at least part of what disable_ipv6 is
>>>> already doing.
>>>
>>> disable_ipv6 is global, the goal was to make this granular and skip
>>> the cost upon early boot, but its been clarified we don't need this.
>>
>> Like Stephen says, you need to make sure you set them before IFF_UP, but
>> beyond that, wouldn't the interface-specific sysctls work?
>
> Yeah that'll do it, unless there is a measurable run time benefit cost
> to never even add these in the first place. Consider a host with tons
> of guests, not sure how many is 'a lot' these days. One would have to
> measure the cost of reducing the amount of time it takes to boot these
> up. As discussed in the other threads though there *is* some use cases
> of assigning IPv4 or IPv6 addresses to the backend interfaces though:
> routing them (although its unclear to me if iptables can be used
> instead, Zoltan?).

Not with OVS, it steals the packet before netfilter hooks.

Zoli
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