netdev - Re: [RFC PATCH net-next 0/5] tcp: TCP tracer

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Message-ID: <D0B44739.74E8A%bmatheny@fb.com>
Date:	Mon, 15 Dec 2014 16:08:23 +0000
From:	Blake Matheny <bmatheny@...com>
To:	Eric Dumazet <eric.dumazet@...il.com>,
	Alexei Starovoitov <alexei.starovoitov@...il.com>,
	Laurent Chavey <chavey@...gle.com>,
	"Yuchung Cheng" <ycheng@...gle.com>
CC:	Martin Lau <kafai@...com>,
	"netdev@...r.kernel.org" <netdev@...r.kernel.org>,
	"David S. Miller" <davem@...emloft.net>,
	"Hannes Frederic Sowa" <hannes@...essinduktion.org>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt@...dmis.org>,
	Lawrence Brakmo <brakmo@...com>, Josef Bacik <jbacik@...com>,
	Kernel Team <Kernel-team@...com>
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH net-next 0/5] tcp: TCP tracer

We have an additional set of patches for web10g that builds on these
tracepoints. It can be made to work either way, but I agree the idea of
something like a sockopt would be really nice.

-Blake

On 12/15/14, 8:03 AM, "Eric Dumazet" <eric.dumazet@...il.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 2014-12-14 at 22:55 -0800, Alexei Starovoitov wrote:
>
>> I think patches 1 and 3 are good additions, since they establish
>> few permanent points of instrumentation in tcp stack.
>> Patches 4-5 look more like use cases of tracepoints established
>> before. They may feel like simple additions and, no doubt,
>> they are useful, but since they expose things via tracing
>> infra they become part of api and cannot be changed later,
>> when more stats would be needed.
>> I think systemtap like scripting on top of patches 1 and 3
>> should solve your use case ?
>> Also, have you looked at recent eBPF work?
>> Though it's not completely ready yet, soon it should
>> be able to do the same stats collection as you have
>> in 4/5 without adding permanent pieces to the kernel.
>
>So it looks like web10g like interfaces are very often requested by
>various teams.
>
>And we have many different views on how to hack this. I am astonished by
>number of hacks I saw about this stuff going on.
>
>What about a clean way, extending current TCP_INFO, which is both
>available as a getsockopt() for socket owners and ss/iproute2
>information for 'external entities'
>
>If we consider web10g info needed, then adding a ftrace/eBPF like
>interface is simply yet another piece of code we need to maintain,
>and the argument of 'this should cost nothing if not activated' is
>nonsense since major players need to constantly monitor TCP metrics and
>behavior.
>
>It seems both FaceBook and Google are working on a subset of web10g.
>
>I suggest we meet together and establish a common ground, preferably
>after Christmas holidays.
>
>Thanks
>
>