netdev - Re: cross namespace interface notification for tun devices

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Date:   Wed, 20 Sep 2017 14:57:34 -0500
From:   Dan Williams <dcbw@...hat.com>
To:     Cong Wang <xiyou.wangcong@...il.com>,
        "Jason A. Donenfeld" <Jason@...c4.com>
Cc:     Netdev <netdev@...r.kernel.org>, Mathias <mathias@...l-andersen.dk>
Subject: Re: cross namespace interface notification for tun devices

On Wed, 2017-09-20 at 11:29 -0700, Cong Wang wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 2:02 PM, Jason A. Donenfeld <Jason@...c4.com>
> wrote:
> > On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 10:40 PM, Cong Wang <xiyou.wangcong@...il.c
> > om> wrote:
> > > By "notification" I assume you mean netlink notification.
> > 
> > Yes, netlink notification.
> > 
> > > The question is why does the process in A still care about
> > > the device sitting in B?
> > > 
> > > Also, the process should be able to receive a last notification
> > > on IFF_UP|IFF_RUNNING before device is finally moved to B.
> > > After this point, it should not have any relation to netns A
> > > any more, like the device were completely gone.
> > 
> > That's very clearly not the case with a tun device. Tun devices
> > work
> > by letting a userspace process control the inputs (ndo_start_xmit)
> > and
> > outputs (netif_rx) of the actual network device. This controlling
> > userspace process needs to know when its own interface that it
> > controls goes up and down. In the kernel, we can do this by just
> > checking dev->flags&IFF_UP, and receive notifications on ndo_open
> > and
> > ndo_stop. In userspace, the controlling process looses the ability
> > to
> > receive notifications like ndo_open/ndo_stop when the interface is
> > moved to a new namespace. After the interface is moved to a
> > namespace,
> > the process will still control inputs and ouputs (ndo_start_xmit
> > and
> > netif_rx), but it will no longer receive netlink notifications for
> > the
> > equivalent of ndo_open and ndo_stop. This is problematic.
> 
> Sounds like we should set NETIF_F_NETNS_LOCAL for tun
> device.
> 
> What is your legitimate use case of send/receive packet to/from
> a tun device in a different netns?

One thought: run openvpn in the master netns, but put its tun0
interface into an application's netns.  Per-application VPN,
essentially?  Or maybe that's not how people do this kind of thing, but
it's a thought.

Dan