netdev - Re: [PATCHv3 iproute2-next 0/5] iproute2: add libbpf support

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Message-ID: <14c9e6da-e764-2e2c-bbbb-bc95992ed258@gmail.com>
Date:   Mon, 9 Nov 2020 21:09:44 -0700
From:   David Ahern <dsahern@...il.com>
To:     Alexei Starovoitov <alexei.starovoitov@...il.com>
Cc:     Stephen Hemminger <stephen@...workplumber.org>,
        Andrii Nakryiko <andrii.nakryiko@...il.com>,
        Jiri Benc <jbenc@...hat.com>,
        Edward Cree <ecree@...arflare.com>,
        Hangbin Liu <haliu@...hat.com>,
        Daniel Borkmann <daniel@...earbox.net>,
        Alexei Starovoitov <ast@...nel.org>,
        Martin KaFai Lau <kafai@...com>,
        Song Liu <songliubraving@...com>, Yonghong Song <yhs@...com>,
        David Miller <davem@...emloft.net>,
        Jesper Dangaard Brouer <brouer@...hat.com>,
        Networking <netdev@...r.kernel.org>, bpf <bpf@...r.kernel.org>,
        Andrii Nakryiko <andrii@...nel.org>,
        Toke Høiland-Jørgensen 
        <toke@...hat.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCHv3 iproute2-next 0/5] iproute2: add libbpf support

On 11/8/20 6:45 PM, Alexei Starovoitov wrote:
> 
> I don't understand why on one side you're pointing out existing quirkiness with
> bpf usability while at the same time arguing to make it _less_ user friendly

I believe you have confused my comments with others. My comments have
focused on one aspect: The insistence by BPF maintainers that all code
bases and users constantly chase latest and greatest versions of
relevant S/W to use BPF - though I believe a lot of the tool chasing
stems from BTF. I am fairly certain I have been consistent in that theme
within this thread.

> when myself, Daniel, Andrii explained in detail what libbpf does and how it
> affects user experience?
> 
> The analogy of libbpf in iproute2 and libbfd in gdb is that both libraries

Your gdb / libbfd analogy misses the mark - by a lot. That analogy is
relevant for bpftool, not iproute2.

iproute2 can leverage libbpf for 3 or 4 tc modules and a few xdp hooks.
That is it, and it is a tiny percentage of the functionality in the package.