Message-ID: <CAADnVQLsmULxJYq9rHS4xyg=VAUeexJTh35vTWTVgjeqwX4D6g@mail.gmail.com>
Date:   Wed, 14 Apr 2021 21:25:10 -0700
From:   Alexei Starovoitov <alexei.starovoitov@...il.com>
To:     Cong Wang <xiyou.wangcong@...il.com>
Cc:     Linux Kernel Network Developers <netdev@...r.kernel.org>,
        bpf <bpf@...r.kernel.org>, duanxiongchun@...edance.com,
        Dongdong Wang <wangdongdong.6@...edance.com>,
        Muchun Song <songmuchun@...edance.com>,
        Cong Wang <cong.wang@...edance.com>,
        Alexei Starovoitov <ast@...nel.org>,
        Daniel Borkmann <daniel@...earbox.net>,
        Andrii Nakryiko <andrii@...nel.org>,
        Martin KaFai Lau <kafai@...com>,
        Song Liu <songliubraving@...com>, Yonghong Song <yhs@...com>
Subject: Re: [RFC Patch bpf-next] bpf: introduce bpf timer

On Wed, Apr 14, 2021 at 9:02 PM Cong Wang <xiyou.wangcong@...il.com> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 4:01 PM Alexei Starovoitov
> <alexei.starovoitov@...il.com> wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 05, 2021 at 05:36:27PM -0700, Cong Wang wrote:
> > > On Fri, Apr 2, 2021 at 4:45 PM Alexei Starovoitov
> > > <alexei.starovoitov@...il.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 02:24:51PM -0700, Cong Wang wrote:
> > > > > > > where the key is the timer ID and the value is the timer expire
> > > > > > > timer.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The timer ID is unnecessary. We cannot introduce new IDR for every new
> > > > > > bpf object. It doesn't scale.
> > > > >
> > > > > The IDR is per map, not per timer.
> > > >
> > > > Per-map is not acceptable. One IDR for all maps with timers is not acceptable either.
> > > > We have 3 IDRs now: for progs, for maps, and for links.
> > > > No other objects need IDRs.
> > > >
> > > > > > Here is how more general timers might look like:
> > > > > > https://lore.kernel.org/bpf/20210310011905.ozz4xahpkqbfkkvd@ast-mbp.dhcp.thefacebook.com/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > include/uapi/linux/bpf.h:
> > > > > > struct bpf_timer {
> > > > > >   u64 opaque;
> > > > > > };
> > > > > > The 'opaque' field contains a pointer to dynamically allocated struct timer_list and other data.
> > > > >
> > > > > This is my initial design as we already discussed, it does not work,
> > > > > please see below.
> > > >
> > > > It does work. The perceived "issue" you referred to is a misunderstanding. See below.
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The prog would do:
> > > > > > struct map_elem {
> > > > > >     int stuff;
> > > > > >     struct bpf_timer timer;
> > > > > > };
> > > > > >
> > > > > > struct {
> > > > > >     __uint(type, BPF_MAP_TYPE_HASH);
> > > > > >     __uint(max_entries, 1);
> > > > > >     __type(key, int);
> > > > > >     __type(value, struct map_elem);
> > > > > > } hmap SEC(".maps");
> > > > > >
> > > > > > static int timer_cb(struct map_elem *elem)
> > > > > > {
> > > > > >     if (whatever && elem->stuff)
> > > > > >         bpf_timer_mod(&elem->timer, new_expire);
> > > > > > }
> > > > > >
> > > > > > int bpf_timer_test(...)
> > > > > > {
> > > > > >     struct map_elem *val;
> > > > > >
> > > > > >     val = bpf_map_lookup_elem(&hmap, &key);
> > > > > >     if (val) {
> > > > > >         bpf_timer_init(&val->timer, timer_cb, flags);
> > > > > >         val->stuff = 123;
> > > > > >         bpf_timer_mod(&val->timer, expires);
> > > > > >     }
> > > > > > }
> > > > > >
> > > > > > bpf_map_update_elem() either from bpf prog or from user space
> > > > > > allocates map element and zeros 8 byte space for the timer pointer.
> > > > > > bpf_timer_init() allocates timer_list and stores it into opaque if opaque == 0.
> > > > > > The validation of timer_cb() is done by the verifier.
> > > > > > bpf_map_delete_elem() either from bpf prog or from user space
> > > > > > does del_timer() if elem->opaque != 0.
> > > > > > If prog refers such hmap as above during prog free the kernel does
> > > > > > for_each_map_elem {if (elem->opaque) del_timer().}
> > > > > > I think that is the simplest way of prevent timers firing past the prog life time.
> > > > > > There could be other ways to solve it (like prog_array and ref/uref).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Pseudo code:
> > > > > > int bpf_timer_init(struct bpf_timer *timer, void *timer_cb, int flags)
> > > > > > {
> > > > > >   if (timer->opaque)
> > > > > >     return -EBUSY;
> > > > > >   t = alloc timer_list
> > > > > >   t->cb = timer_cb;
> > > > > >   t->..
> > > > > >   timer->opaque = (long)t;
> > > > > > }
> > > > > >
> > > > > > int bpf_timer_mod(struct bpf_timer *timer, u64 expires)
> > > > > > {
> > > > > >   if (!time->opaque)
> > > > > >     return -EINVAL;
> > > > > >   t = (struct timer_list *)timer->opaque;
> > > > > >   mod_timer(t,..);
> > > > > > }
> > > > > >
> > > > > > int bpf_timer_del(struct bpf_timer *timer)
> > > > > > {
> > > > > >   if (!time->opaque)
> > > > > >     return -EINVAL;
> > > > > >   t = (struct timer_list *)timer->opaque;
> > > > > >   del_timer(t);
> > > > > > }
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The verifier would need to check that 8 bytes occupied by bpf_timer and not accessed
> > > > > > via load/store by the program. The same way it does it for bpf_spin_lock.
> > > > >
> > > > > This does not work, because bpf_timer_del() has to be matched
> > > > > with bpf_timer_init(), otherwise we would leak timer resources.
> > > > > For example:
> > > > >
> > > > > SEC("foo")
> > > > > bad_ebpf_code()
> > > > > {
> > > > >   struct bpf_timer t;
> > > > >   bpf_timer_init(&t, ...); // allocate a timer
> > > > >   bpf_timer_mod(&t, ..);
> > > > >   // end of BPF program
> > > > >   // now the timer is leaked, no one will delete it
> > > > > }
> > > > >
> > > > > We can not enforce the matching in the verifier, because users would
> > > > > have to call bpf_timer_del() before exiting, which is not what we want
> > > > > either.
> > > >
> > > > ```
> > > > bad_ebpf_code()
> > > > {
> > > >   struct bpf_timer t;
> > > > ```
> > > > is not at all what was proposed. This kind of code will be rejected by the verifier.
> > > >
> > > > 'struct bpf_timer' has to be part of the map element and the verifier will enforce that
> > > > just like it does so for bpf_spin_lock.
> > > > Try writing the following program:
> > > > ```
> > > > bad_ebpf_code()
> > > > {
> > > >   struct bpf_spin_lock t;
> > > >   bpf_spin_lock(&t);
> > > > }
> > > > ``
> > > > and then follow the code to see why the verifier rejects it.
> > >
> > > Well, embedding a spinlock makes sense as it is used to protect
> > > the value it is associated with, but for a timer, no, it has no value
> > > to associate.
> >
> > The way kernel code is using timers is alwasy by embedding timer_list
> > into another data structure and then using container_of() in a callback.
> > So all existing use cases of timers disagree with your point.
>
> Not always. Data can be passed as a global data structure visible to
> timer callback.

global data is racy. That's not an option at all.

> >
> > > Even if it does, updating it requires a lock as the
> > > callback can run concurrently with value update.
> >
> > No lock is necessary.
> > map_value_update_elem can either return EBUSY if timer_list != NULL
> > or it can del_timer() before updating the whole value.
> > Both choices can be expressed with flags.
>
> This sounds problematic, because the hash map is visible to
> users but not the timers associated, hence in user-space users
> just unexpectedly get EBUSY.

As I said earlier:
"
bpf_map_update_elem() either from bpf prog or from user space
allocates map element and zeros 8 byte space for the timer pointer.
"
and also said that EBUSY could be default or non default behavior
expressed with flags passed into update.

> >
> > > So, they are very
> > > different hence should be treated differently rather than similarly.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > The implementation of what I'm proposing is straightforward.
> > > > I certainly understand that it might look intimidating and "impossible",
> > > > but it's really quite simple.
> > >
> > > How do you refcnt the struct bpf_prog with your approach? Or with
> >
> > you don't. More so prog must not be refcnted otherwise it's a circular
> > dependency between progs and maps.
> > We did that in the past with prog_array and the api became unpleasant
> > and not user friendly. Not going to repeat the same mistake again.
>
> Then how do you prevent prog being unloaded when the timer callback
> is still active?

As I said earlier:
"
If prog refers such hmap as above during prog free the kernel does
for_each_map_elem {if (elem->opaque) del_timer().}
"

>
> >
> > > actually any attempt to create timers in kernel-space. I am not intimidated
> > > but quite happy to hear. If you do it in the verifier, we do not know which
> > > code path is actually executed when running it. If you do it with JIT, I do
> > > not see how JIT can even get the right struct bpf_prog pointer in context.
> >
> > Neither. See pseudo code for bpf_timer_init/bpf_timer_mod in the earlier email.
> >
> > > This is how I concluded it looks impossible.
> >
> > Please explain what 'impossible' or buggy you see in the pseudo code.
>
> Your pseudo code never shows how to refcnt the struct bpf_prog, which
> is critical to the bpf timer design.

As I said earlier: nack to refcnt progs.

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