netdev - Re: [PATCH bpf-next] xsk: support AF

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Message-ID: <87a6ofgmbq.fsf@toke.dk>
Date:   Fri, 28 May 2021 12:54:49 +0200
From:   Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@...hat.com>
To:     Daniel Borkmann <daniel@...earbox.net>,
        Magnus Karlsson <magnus.karlsson@...il.com>,
        Jesper Dangaard Brouer <brouer@...hat.com>
Cc:     Xuan Zhuo <xuanzhuo@...ux.alibaba.com>,
        Eelco Chaudron <echaudro@...hat.com>,
        Lorenzo Bianconi <lorenzo.bianconi@...hat.com>,
        Björn Töpel <bjorn@...nel.org>,
        Magnus Karlsson <magnus.karlsson@...el.com>,
        Jonathan Lemon <jonathan.lemon@...il.com>,
        "David S. Miller" <davem@...emloft.net>,
        Jakub Kicinski <kuba@...nel.org>,
        Alexei Starovoitov <ast@...nel.org>,
        John Fastabend <john.fastabend@...il.com>,
        Andrii Nakryiko <andrii@...nel.org>,
        Martin KaFai Lau <kafai@...com>,
        Song Liu <songliubraving@...com>, Yonghong Song <yhs@...com>,
        KP Singh <kpsingh@...nel.org>,
        Willem de Bruijn <willemb@...gle.com>,
        Xie He <xie.he.0141@...il.com>,
        Eric Dumazet <edumazet@...gle.com>,
        John Ogness <john.ogness@...utronix.de>,
        Wang Hai <wanghai38@...wei.com>,
        Tanner Love <tannerlove@...gle.com>,
        Eyal Birger <eyal.birger@...il.com>,
        Menglong Dong <dong.menglong@....com.cn>,
        Network Development <netdev@...r.kernel.org>,
        bpf <bpf@...r.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH bpf-next] xsk: support AF_PACKET

Daniel Borkmann <daniel@...earbox.net> writes:

> On 5/28/21 12:00 PM, Magnus Karlsson wrote:
>> On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 11:52 AM Jesper Dangaard Brouer
>> <brouer@...hat.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 28 May 2021 17:02:01 +0800
>>> Xuan Zhuo <xuanzhuo@...ux.alibaba.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 28 May 2021 10:55:58 +0200, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@...hat.com> wrote:
>>>>> Xuan Zhuo <xuanzhuo@...ux.alibaba.com> writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In xsk mode, users cannot use AF_PACKET(tcpdump) to observe the current
>>>>>> rx/tx data packets. This feature is very important in many cases. So
>>>>>> this patch allows AF_PACKET to obtain xsk packages.
>>>>>
>>>>> You can use xdpdump to dump the packets from the XDP program before it
>>>>> gets redirected into the XSK:
>>>>> https://github.com/xdp-project/xdp-tools/tree/master/xdp-dump
>>>>
>>>> Wow, this is a good idea.
>>>
>>> Yes, it is rather cool (credit to Eelco).  Notice the extra info you
>>> can capture from 'exit', like XDP return codes, if_index, rx_queue.
>>>
>>> The tool uses the perf ring-buffer to send/copy data to userspace.
>>> This is actually surprisingly fast, but I still think AF_XDP will be
>>> faster (but it usually 'steals' the packet).
>>>
>>> Another (crazy?) idea is to extend this (and xdpdump), is to leverage
>>> Hangbin's recent XDP_REDIRECT extension e624d4ed4aa8 ("xdp: Extend
>>> xdp_redirect_map with broadcast support").  We now have a
>>> xdp_redirect_map flag BPF_F_BROADCAST, what if we create a
>>> BPF_F_CLONE_PASS flag?
>>>
>>> The semantic meaning of BPF_F_CLONE_PASS flag is to copy/clone the
>>> packet for the specified map target index (e.g AF_XDP map), but
>>> afterwards it does like veth/cpumap and creates an SKB from the
>>> xdp_frame (see __xdp_build_skb_from_frame()) and send to netstack.
>>> (Feel free to kick me if this doesn't make any sense)
>> 
>> This would be a smooth way to implement clone support for AF_XDP. If
>> we had this and someone added AF_XDP support to libpcap, we could both
>> capture AF_XDP traffic with tcpdump (using this clone functionality in
>> the XDP program) and speed up tcpdump for dumping traffic destined for
>> regular sockets. Would that solve your use case Xuan? Note that I have
>> not looked into the BPF_F_CLONE_PASS code, so do not know at this
>> point what it would take to support this for XSKMAPs.
>
> Recently also ended up with something similar for our XDP LB to record pcaps [0] ;)
> My question is.. tcpdump doesn't really care where the packet data comes from,
> so why not extending libpcap's Linux-related internals to either capture from
> perf RB or BPF ringbuf rather than AF_PACKET sockets? Cloning is slow, and if
> you need to end up creating an skb which is then cloned once again inside AF_PACKET
> it's even worse. Just relying and reading out, say, perf RB you don't need any
> clones at all.

We discussed this when creating xdpdump and decided to keep it as a
separate tool for the time being. I forget the details of the
discussion, maybe Eelco remembers.

Anyway, xdpdump does have a "pipe pcap to stdout" feature so you can do
`xdpdump | tcpdump` and get the interactive output; and it will also
save pcap information to disk, of course (using pcap-ng so it can also
save metadata like XDP program name and return code).

-Toke