netdev - Re: [PATCH net-next v2] samples/bpf: fixup some tools to be able to support xdp multibuffer

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Message-ID: <87fscjakba.fsf@toke.dk>
Date:   Mon, 09 Jan 2023 14:50:33 +0100
From:   Toke Høiland-Jørgensen <toke@...hat.com>
To:     Tariq Toukan <ttoukan.linux@...il.com>,
        Jakub Kicinski <kuba@...nel.org>,
        Andy Gospodarek <andrew.gospodarek@...adcom.com>
Cc:     Lorenzo Bianconi <lorenzo@...nel.org>, ast@...nel.org,
        daniel@...earbox.net, davem@...emloft.net, hawk@...nel.org,
        john.fastabend@...il.com, andrii@...nel.org, kafai@...com,
        songliubraving@...com, yhs@...com, kpsingh@...nel.org,
        lorenzo.bianconi@...hat.com, netdev@...r.kernel.org,
        bpf@...r.kernel.org, Jesper Dangaard Brouer <brouer@...hat.com>,
        Ilias Apalodimas <ilias.apalodimas@...aro.org>, gal@...dia.com,
        Saeed Mahameed <saeedm@...dia.com>, tariqt@...dia.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next v2] samples/bpf: fixup some tools to be able to
 support xdp multibuffer

Tariq Toukan <ttoukan.linux@...il.com> writes:

> On 08/01/2023 14:33, Tariq Toukan wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> On 05/01/2023 20:16, Jakub Kicinski wrote:
>>> On Thu, 5 Jan 2023 11:57:32 -0500 Andy Gospodarek wrote:
>>>>> So my main concern would be that if we "allow" this, the only way to
>>>>> write an interoperable XDP program will be to use bpf_xdp_load_bytes()
>>>>> for every packet access. Which will be slower than DPA, so we may 
>>>>> end up
>>>>> inadvertently slowing down all of the XDP ecosystem, because no one is
>>>>> going to bother with writing two versions of their programs. Whereas if
>>>>> you can rely on packet headers always being in the linear part, you can
>>>>> write a lot of the "look at headers and make a decision" type programs
>>>>> using just DPA, and they'll work for multibuf as well.
>>>>
>>>> The question I would have is what is really the 'slow down' for
>>>> bpf_xdp_load_bytes() vs DPA?  I know you and Jesper can tell me how many
>>>> instructions each use. :)
>>>
>>> Until we have an efficient and inlined DPA access to frags an
>>> unconditional memcpy() of the first 2 cachelines-worth of headers
>>> in the driver must be faster than a piece-by-piece bpf_xdp_load_bytes()
>>> onto the stack, right?
>>>
>>>> Taking a step back...years ago Dave mentioned wanting to make XDP
>>>> programs easy to write and it feels like using these accessor APIs would
>>>> help accomplish that.  If the kernel examples use bpf_xdp_load_bytes()
>>>> accessors everywhere then that would accomplish that.
>>>
>>> I've been pushing for an skb_header_pointer()-like helper but
>>> the semantics were not universally loved :)
>> 
>> Maybe it's time to re-consider.
>> 
>> Is it something like an API that given an offset returns a pointer + 
>> allowed length to be accessed?
>> 
>> This sounds like a good direction to me, that avoids having any 
>> linear-part-length assumptions, while preserving good performance.
>> 
>> Maybe we can still require/guarantee that each single header (eth, ip, 
>> tcp, ...) does not cross a frag/page boundary. For otherwise, a prog 
>> needs to handle cases where headers span several fragments, so it has to 
>> reconstruct the header by copying the different parts into some local 
>> buffer.
>> 
>> This can be achieved by having another assumption that AFAIK already 
>> holds today: all fragments are of size PAGE_SIZE.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Tariq
>
> This can be a good starting point:
> static void *bpf_xdp_pointer(struct xdp_buff *xdp, u32 offset, u32 len)
>
> It's currently not exposed as a bpf-helper, and it works a bit 
> differently to what I mentioned earlier: It gets the desired length, and 
> fails in case it's not continuously accessible (i.e. this piece of data 
> spans multiple frags).

Did a bit of digging through the mail archives. Exposing
bpf_xdp_pointer() as a helper was proposed back in March last year:

https://lore.kernel.org/r/20220306234311.452206-1-memxor@gmail.com

The discussion of this seems to have ended on "let's use dynptrs
instead". There was a patch series posted for this as well, which seems
to have stalled out with this comment from Alexei in October:

https://lore.kernel.org/r/CAADnVQKhv2YBrUAQJq6UyqoZJ-FGNQbKenGoPySPNK+GaOjBOg@mail.gmail.com

-Toke