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Message-ID: <1928187.1750115758@famine>
Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2025 16:15:58 -0700
From: Jay Vosburgh <jv@...sburgh.net>
To: David Wilder <wilder@...ibm.com>
cc: netdev@...r.kernel.org, pradeeps@...ux.vnet.ibm.com,
pradeep@...ibm.com, i.maximets@....org, amorenoz@...hat.com,
haliu@...hat.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next v3 2/4] bonding: Extend arp_ip_target format to
allow for a list of vlan tags.
David Wilder <wilder@...ibm.com> wrote:
>This change extends the "arp_ip_target" parameter format to allow for a
>list of vlan tags to be included for each arp target. This new list of
>tags is optional and may be omitted to preserve the current format and
>process of gathering tags. When provided the list of tags circumvents
>the process of gathering tags by using the supplied list. An empty list
>can be provided to simply skip the process of gathering tags.
>
>An update to iproute is required to use this change.
>
>Signed-off-by: David Wilder <wilder@...ibm.com>
>---
> drivers/net/bonding/bond_main.c | 51 +++++-----
> drivers/net/bonding/bond_netlink.c | 11 ++-
> drivers/net/bonding/bond_options.c | 57 ++++++-----
> drivers/net/bonding/bond_procfs.c | 5 +-
> drivers/net/bonding/bond_sysfs.c | 9 +-
> include/net/bonding.h | 146 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> 6 files changed, 229 insertions(+), 50 deletions(-)
>
>diff --git a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_main.c b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_main.c
>index ac654b384ea1..a26e17bdcc48 100644
>--- a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_main.c
>+++ b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_main.c
>@@ -3029,8 +3029,6 @@ static bool bond_has_this_ip(struct bonding *bond, __be32 ip)
> return ret;
> }
>
>-#define BOND_VLAN_PROTO_NONE cpu_to_be16(0xffff)
>-
> static bool bond_handle_vlan(struct slave *slave, struct bond_vlan_tag *tags,
> struct sk_buff *skb)
> {
>@@ -3144,22 +3142,24 @@ struct bond_vlan_tag *bond_verify_device_path(struct net_device *start_dev,
>
> static void bond_arp_send_all(struct bonding *bond, struct slave *slave)
> {
>- struct rtable *rt;
>- struct bond_vlan_tag *tags;
> struct bond_arp_target *targets = bond->params.arp_targets;
>+ struct bond_vlan_tag *tags;
> __be32 target_ip, addr;
>+ struct rtable *rt;
> int i;
>
> for (i = 0; i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS && targets[i].target_ip; i++) {
> target_ip = targets[i].target_ip;
> tags = targets[i].tags;
>+ char pbuf[BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE];
>
>- slave_dbg(bond->dev, slave->dev, "%s: target %pI4\n",
>- __func__, &target_ip);
>+ bond_arp_target_to_string(&targets[i], pbuf, sizeof(pbuf));
>+ slave_dbg(bond->dev, slave->dev, "%s: target %s\n", __func__, pbuf);
As an aside to my main question, below, I'll point out here that
the target is going to be put into a string even if debug is disabled.
>
> /* Find out through which dev should the packet go */
> rt = ip_route_output(dev_net(bond->dev), target_ip, 0, 0, 0,
> RT_SCOPE_LINK);
>+
> if (IS_ERR(rt)) {
> /* there's no route to target_ip - try to send arp
> * probe to generate any traffic (arp_validate=0)
>@@ -3177,9 +3177,13 @@ static void bond_arp_send_all(struct bonding *bond, struct slave *slave)
> if (rt->dst.dev == bond->dev)
> goto found;
>
>- rcu_read_lock();
>- tags = bond_verify_device_path(bond->dev, rt->dst.dev, 0);
>- rcu_read_unlock();
>+ if (!tags) {
>+ rcu_read_lock();
>+ tags = bond_verify_device_path(bond->dev, rt->dst.dev, 0);
>+ /* cache the tags */
>+ targets[i].tags = tags;
>+ rcu_read_unlock();
>+ }
>
> if (!IS_ERR_OR_NULL(tags))
> goto found;
>@@ -3195,7 +3199,6 @@ static void bond_arp_send_all(struct bonding *bond, struct slave *slave)
> addr = bond_confirm_addr(rt->dst.dev, target_ip, 0);
> ip_rt_put(rt);
> bond_arp_send(slave, ARPOP_REQUEST, target_ip, addr, tags);
>- kfree(tags);
> }
> }
>
>@@ -6077,6 +6080,7 @@ static void bond_uninit(struct net_device *bond_dev)
> bond_for_each_slave(bond, slave, iter)
> __bond_release_one(bond_dev, slave->dev, true, true);
> netdev_info(bond_dev, "Released all slaves\n");
>+ bond_free_vlan_tags(bond->params.arp_targets);
>
> #ifdef CONFIG_XFRM_OFFLOAD
> mutex_destroy(&bond->ipsec_lock);
>@@ -6283,21 +6287,26 @@ static int __init bond_check_params(struct bond_params *params)
>
> for (arp_ip_count = 0, i = 0;
> (arp_ip_count < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS) && arp_ip_target[i]; i++) {
>- __be32 ip;
>+ struct bond_arp_target tmp_arp_target;
>
>- /* not a complete check, but good enough to catch mistakes */
>- if (!in4_pton(arp_ip_target[i], -1, (u8 *)&ip, -1, NULL) ||
>- !bond_is_ip_target_ok(ip)) {
>+ if (bond_arp_ip_target_opt_parse(arp_ip_target[i], &tmp_arp_target)) {
> pr_warn("Warning: bad arp_ip_target module parameter (%s), ARP monitoring will not be performed\n",
> arp_ip_target[i]);
> arp_interval = 0;
>- } else {
>- if (bond_get_targets_ip(arp_target, ip) == -1)
>- arp_target[arp_ip_count++].target_ip = ip;
>- else
>- pr_warn("Warning: duplicate address %pI4 in arp_ip_target, skipping\n",
>- &ip);
>+ break;
> }
>+
>+ if (bond_get_targets_ip(arp_target, tmp_arp_target.target_ip) != -1) {
>+ pr_warn("Warning: duplicate address %pI4 in arp_ip_target, skipping\n",
>+ &tmp_arp_target.target_ip);
>+ kfree(tmp_arp_target.tags);
>+ continue;
>+ }
>+
>+ arp_target[i].target_ip = tmp_arp_target.target_ip;
>+ arp_target[i].tags = tmp_arp_target.tags;
>+ arp_target[i].flags |= BOND_TARGET_DONTFREE;
>+ ++arp_ip_count;
> }
>
> if (arp_interval && !arp_ip_count) {
>@@ -6663,7 +6672,7 @@ static void __exit bonding_exit(void)
>
> bond_netlink_fini();
> unregister_pernet_subsys(&bond_net_ops);
>-
>+ bond_free_vlan_tags_all(bonding_defaults.arp_targets);
> bond_destroy_debugfs();
>
> #ifdef CONFIG_NET_POLL_CONTROLLER
>diff --git a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_netlink.c b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_netlink.c
>index 1a3d17754c0a..bab980e84c08 100644
>--- a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_netlink.c
>+++ b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_netlink.c
>@@ -287,14 +287,21 @@ static int bond_changelink(struct net_device *bond_dev, struct nlattr *tb[],
>
> bond_option_arp_ip_targets_clear(bond);
> nla_for_each_nested(attr, data[IFLA_BOND_ARP_IP_TARGET], rem) {
>+ char target_str[BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE];
> __be32 target;
>
> if (nla_len(attr) < sizeof(target))
> return -EINVAL;
>
>- target = nla_get_be32(attr);
>+ if (nla_len(attr) > sizeof(target)) {
>+ snprintf(target_str, sizeof(target_str),
>+ "%s%s", "+", (__force char *)nla_data(attr));
>+ bond_opt_initstr(&newval, target_str);
>+ } else {
>+ target = nla_get_be32(attr);
>+ bond_opt_initval(&newval, (__force u64)target);
>+ }
Here, and further down in bond_arp_ip_target_opt_parse(),
there's a lot of string handling that seems out place. Why isn't the
string parsing done in user space (iproute, et al), and the tags passed
to the kernel in IFLA_BOND_ARP_IP_TARGET as an optional nested
attribute?
>
>- bond_opt_initval(&newval, (__force u64)target);
> err = __bond_opt_set(bond, BOND_OPT_ARP_TARGETS,
> &newval,
> data[IFLA_BOND_ARP_IP_TARGET],
>diff --git a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_options.c b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_options.c
>index e4b7eb376575..42a11483320c 100644
>--- a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_options.c
>+++ b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_options.c
>@@ -31,8 +31,8 @@ static int bond_option_use_carrier_set(struct bonding *bond,
> const struct bond_opt_value *newval);
> static int bond_option_arp_interval_set(struct bonding *bond,
> const struct bond_opt_value *newval);
>-static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target);
>-static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target);
>+static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, struct bond_arp_target target);
>+static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, struct bond_arp_target target);
> static int bond_option_arp_ip_targets_set(struct bonding *bond,
> const struct bond_opt_value *newval);
> static int bond_option_ns_ip6_targets_set(struct bonding *bond,
>@@ -1115,7 +1115,7 @@ static int bond_option_arp_interval_set(struct bonding *bond,
> }
>
> static void _bond_options_arp_ip_target_set(struct bonding *bond, int slot,
>- __be32 target,
>+ struct bond_arp_target target,
> unsigned long last_rx)
> {
> struct bond_arp_target *targets = bond->params.arp_targets;
>@@ -1125,24 +1125,24 @@ static void _bond_options_arp_ip_target_set(struct bonding *bond, int slot,
> if (slot >= 0 && slot < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS) {
> bond_for_each_slave(bond, slave, iter)
> slave->target_last_arp_rx[slot] = last_rx;
>- targets[slot].target_ip = target;
>+ memcpy(&targets[slot], &target, sizeof(target));
> }
> }
>
>-static int _bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
>+static int _bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, struct bond_arp_target target)
> {
> struct bond_arp_target *targets = bond->params.arp_targets;
> int ind;
>
>- if (!bond_is_ip_target_ok(target)) {
>+ if (!bond_is_ip_target_ok(target.target_ip)) {
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "invalid ARP target %pI4 specified for addition\n",
>- &target);
>+ &target.target_ip);
> return -EINVAL;
> }
>
>- if (bond_get_targets_ip(targets, target) != -1) { /* dup */
>+ if (bond_get_targets_ip(targets, target.target_ip) != -1) { /* dup */
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "ARP target %pI4 is already present\n",
>- &target);
>+ &target.target_ip);
> return -EINVAL;
> }
>
>@@ -1152,19 +1152,19 @@ static int _bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
> return -EINVAL;
> }
>
>- netdev_dbg(bond->dev, "Adding ARP target %pI4\n", &target);
>+ netdev_dbg(bond->dev, "Adding ARP target %pI4\n", &target.target_ip);
>
> _bond_options_arp_ip_target_set(bond, ind, target, jiffies);
>
> return 0;
> }
>
>-static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
>+static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(struct bonding *bond, struct bond_arp_target target)
> {
> return _bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(bond, target);
> }
>
>-static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
>+static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, struct bond_arp_target target)
> {
> struct bond_arp_target *targets = bond->params.arp_targets;
> struct list_head *iter;
>@@ -1172,23 +1172,23 @@ static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
> unsigned long *targets_rx;
> int ind, i;
>
>- if (!bond_is_ip_target_ok(target)) {
>+ if (!bond_is_ip_target_ok(target.target_ip)) {
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "invalid ARP target %pI4 specified for removal\n",
>- &target);
>+ &target.target_ip);
> return -EINVAL;
> }
>
>- ind = bond_get_targets_ip(targets, target);
>+ ind = bond_get_targets_ip(targets, target.target_ip);
> if (ind == -1) {
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "unable to remove nonexistent ARP target %pI4\n",
>- &target);
>+ &target.target_ip);
> return -EINVAL;
> }
>
> if (ind == 0 && !targets[1].target_ip && bond->params.arp_interval)
> netdev_warn(bond->dev, "Removing last arp target with arp_interval on\n");
>
>- netdev_dbg(bond->dev, "Removing ARP target %pI4\n", &target);
>+ netdev_dbg(bond->dev, "Removing ARP target %pI4\n", &target.target_ip);
>
> bond_for_each_slave(bond, slave, iter) {
> targets_rx = slave->target_last_arp_rx;
>@@ -1196,9 +1196,16 @@ static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
> targets_rx[i] = targets_rx[i+1];
> targets_rx[i] = 0;
> }
>- for (i = ind; (i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS - 1) && targets[i + 1].target_ip; i++)
>- targets[i] = targets[i+1];
>+
>+ bond_free_vlan_tag(&targets[ind]);
>+
>+ for (i = ind; (i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS - 1) && targets[i + 1].target_ip; i++) {
>+ targets[i].target_ip = targets[i + 1].target_ip;
>+ targets[i].tags = targets[i + 1].tags;
>+ targets[i].flags = targets[i + 1].flags;
>+ }
> targets[i].target_ip = 0;
>+ targets[i].tags = NULL;
>
> return 0;
> }
>@@ -1206,20 +1213,24 @@ static int bond_option_arp_ip_target_rem(struct bonding *bond, __be32 target)
> void bond_option_arp_ip_targets_clear(struct bonding *bond)
> {
> int i;
>+ struct bond_arp_target empty_target;
>+
>+ empty_target.target_ip = 0;
>+ empty_target.tags = NULL;
>
> for (i = 0; i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS; i++)
>- _bond_options_arp_ip_target_set(bond, i, 0, 0);
>+ _bond_options_arp_ip_target_set(bond, i, empty_target, 0);
> }
>
> static int bond_option_arp_ip_targets_set(struct bonding *bond,
> const struct bond_opt_value *newval)
> {
> int ret = -EPERM;
>- __be32 target;
>+ struct bond_arp_target target;
>
> if (newval->string) {
> if (strlen(newval->string) < 1 ||
>- !in4_pton(newval->string + 1, -1, (u8 *)&target, -1, NULL)) {
>+ bond_arp_ip_target_opt_parse(newval->string + 1, &target)) {
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "invalid ARP target specified\n");
> return ret;
> }
>@@ -1230,7 +1241,7 @@ static int bond_option_arp_ip_targets_set(struct bonding *bond,
> else
> netdev_err(bond->dev, "no command found in arp_ip_targets file - use +<addr> or -<addr>\n");
> } else {
>- target = newval->value;
>+ target.target_ip = newval->value;
> ret = bond_option_arp_ip_target_add(bond, target);
> }
>
>diff --git a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_procfs.c b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_procfs.c
>index 94e6fd7041ee..b07944396912 100644
>--- a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_procfs.c
>+++ b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_procfs.c
>@@ -111,6 +111,7 @@ static void bond_info_show_master(struct seq_file *seq)
>
> /* ARP information */
> if (bond->params.arp_interval > 0) {
>+ char pbuf[BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE];
> int printed = 0;
>
> seq_printf(seq, "ARP Polling Interval (ms): %d\n",
>@@ -125,7 +126,9 @@ static void bond_info_show_master(struct seq_file *seq)
> break;
> if (printed)
> seq_printf(seq, ",");
>- seq_printf(seq, " %pI4", &bond->params.arp_targets[i].target_ip);
>+ bond_arp_target_to_string(&bond->params.arp_targets[i],
>+ pbuf, sizeof(pbuf));
>+ seq_printf(seq, " %s", pbuf);
> printed = 1;
> }
> seq_printf(seq, "\n");
>diff --git a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_sysfs.c b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_sysfs.c
>index d7c09e0a14dd..feff53e69bd3 100644
>--- a/drivers/net/bonding/bond_sysfs.c
>+++ b/drivers/net/bonding/bond_sysfs.c
>@@ -288,11 +288,14 @@ static ssize_t bonding_show_arp_targets(struct device *d,
> {
> struct bonding *bond = to_bond(d);
> int i, res = 0;
>+ char pbuf[BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE];
>
> for (i = 0; i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS; i++) {
>- if (bond->params.arp_targets[i].target_ip)
>- res += sysfs_emit_at(buf, res, "%pI4 ",
>- &bond->params.arp_targets[i].target_ip);
>+ if (bond->params.arp_targets[i].target_ip) {
>+ bond_arp_target_to_string(&bond->params.arp_targets[i],
>+ pbuf, sizeof(pbuf));
>+ res += sysfs_emit_at(buf, res, "%s ", pbuf);
>+ }
There is no expectation that sysfs should support new bonding
API elements; only netlink / iproute2 support matters. If sysfs is the
reason to do the string parsing in the kernel, then I imagine this could
all move into userspace.
-J
> }
> if (res)
> buf[res-1] = '\n'; /* eat the leftover space */
>diff --git a/include/net/bonding.h b/include/net/bonding.h
>index 5b4c43f02c89..2067aa4df123 100644
>--- a/include/net/bonding.h
>+++ b/include/net/bonding.h
>@@ -23,6 +23,7 @@
> #include <linux/etherdevice.h>
> #include <linux/reciprocal_div.h>
> #include <linux/if_link.h>
>+#include <linux/inet.h>
>
> #include <net/bond_3ad.h>
> #include <net/bond_alb.h>
>@@ -787,6 +788,151 @@ static inline int bond_get_targets_ip6(struct in6_addr *targets, struct in6_addr
> }
> #endif
>
>+#define BOND_VLAN_PROTO_NONE cpu_to_be16(0xffff)
>+#define BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE 256
>+
>+/* Convert vlan_list into struct bond_vlan_tag.
>+ * Inspired by bond_verify_device_path();
>+ */
>+static inline struct bond_vlan_tag *bond_vlan_tags_parse(char *vlan_list, int level)
>+{
>+ struct bond_vlan_tag *tags;
>+ char *vlan;
>+
>+ if (!vlan_list || strlen(vlan_list) == 0) {
>+ tags = kcalloc(level + 1, sizeof(*tags), GFP_ATOMIC);
>+ if (!tags)
>+ return ERR_PTR(-ENOMEM);
>+ tags[level].vlan_proto = BOND_VLAN_PROTO_NONE;
>+ return tags;
>+ }
>+
>+ for (vlan = strsep(&vlan_list, "/"); (vlan != 0); level++) {
>+ tags = bond_vlan_tags_parse(vlan_list, level + 1);
>+ if (IS_ERR_OR_NULL(tags)) {
>+ if (IS_ERR(tags))
>+ return tags;
>+ continue;
>+ }
>+
>+ tags[level].vlan_proto = __cpu_to_be16(ETH_P_8021Q);
>+ if (kstrtou16(vlan, 0, &tags[level].vlan_id)) {
>+ kfree(tags);
>+ return ERR_PTR(-EINVAL);
>+ }
>+
>+ if (tags[level].vlan_id < 1 || tags[level].vlan_id > 4094) {
>+ kfree(tags);
>+ return ERR_PTR(-EINVAL);
>+ }
>+
>+ return tags;
>+ }
>+
>+ return NULL;
>+}
>+
>+/**
>+ * bond_arp_ip_target_opt_parse - parse a single arp_ip_target option value string
>+ * @src: the option value to be parsed
>+ * @dest: struct bond_arp_target to place the results.
>+ *
>+ * This function parses a single arp_ip_target string in the form:
>+ * x.x.x.x[tag/....] into a struct bond_arp_target.
>+ * Returns 0 on success.
>+ */
>+static inline int bond_arp_ip_target_opt_parse(char *src, struct bond_arp_target *dest)
>+{
>+ char *ipv4, *vlan_list;
>+ char target[BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE], *args;
>+ struct bond_vlan_tag *tags = NULL;
>+ __be32 ip;
>+
>+ if (strlen(src) > BOND_OPTION_STRING_MAX_SIZE)
>+ return -E2BIG;
>+
>+ pr_debug("Parsing arp_ip_target (%s)\n", src);
>+
>+ /* copy arp_ip_target[i] to local array, strsep works
>+ * destructively...
>+ */
>+ args = target;
>+ strscpy(target, src);
>+ ipv4 = strsep(&args, "[");
>+
>+ /* not a complete check, but good enough to catch mistakes */
>+ if (!in4_pton(ipv4, -1, (u8 *)&ip, -1, NULL) ||
>+ !bond_is_ip_target_ok(ip)) {
>+ return -EINVAL;
>+ }
>+
>+ /* extract vlan tags */
>+ vlan_list = strsep(&args, "]");
>+
>+ /* If a vlan list was not supplied skip the processing of the list.
>+ * A value of "[]" is a valid list and should be handled a such.
>+ */
>+ if (vlan_list) {
>+ tags = bond_vlan_tags_parse(vlan_list, 0);
>+ dest->flags |= BOND_TARGET_USERTAGS;
>+ if (IS_ERR(tags))
>+ return PTR_ERR(tags);
>+ }
>+
>+ dest->target_ip = ip;
>+ dest->tags = tags;
>+
>+ return 0;
>+}
>+
>+static inline int bond_arp_target_to_string(struct bond_arp_target *target,
>+ char *buf, int size)
>+{
>+ struct bond_vlan_tag *tags = target->tags;
>+ int i, num = 0;
>+
>+ if (!(target->flags & BOND_TARGET_USERTAGS)) {
>+ num = snprintf(&buf[0], size, "%pI4", &target->target_ip);
>+ return num;
>+ }
>+
>+ num = snprintf(&buf[0], size, "%pI4[", &target->target_ip);
>+ if (tags) {
>+ for (i = 0; (tags[i].vlan_proto != BOND_VLAN_PROTO_NONE); i++) {
>+ if (!tags[i].vlan_id)
>+ continue;
>+ if (i != 0)
>+ num = num + snprintf(&buf[num], size-num, "/");
>+ num = num + snprintf(&buf[num], size-num, "%u",
>+ tags[i].vlan_id);
>+ }
>+ }
>+ snprintf(&buf[num], size-num, "]");
>+ return num;
>+}
>+
>+static inline void bond_free_vlan_tag(struct bond_arp_target *target)
>+{
>+ if (!(target->flags & BOND_TARGET_DONTFREE))
>+ kfree(target->tags);
>+}
>+
>+static inline void __bond_free_vlan_tags(struct bond_arp_target *targets, int all)
>+{
>+ int i;
>+
>+ for (i = 0; i < BOND_MAX_ARP_TARGETS && targets[i].tags; i++) {
>+ if (!all)
>+ bond_free_vlan_tag(&targets[i]);
>+ else
>+ kfree(targets[i].tags);
>+ }
>+}
>+
>+#define bond_free_vlan_tags(targets) __bond_free_vlan_tags(targets, 0)
>+#define bond_free_vlan_tags_all(targets) __bond_free_vlan_tags(targets, 1)
>+
>+
> /* exported from bond_main.c */
> extern unsigned int bond_net_id;
>
>--
>2.43.5
>
---
-Jay Vosburgh, jv@...sburgh.net
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