Date: Tue Dec 27 04:01:53 2005
From: leife at dls.net (Leif Ericksen)
Subject: Spy Agency Mined Vast Data Trove

I am sorry... The largest controlling BODY is the U.N  There are several
cases here in the US of soldiers that refused to take orders from U.N
Officers or place a UN flag on the (US) uniform.  These military folks
stated they took an oath to the US NOT the (stupid) UN.

So the US is pushed around by the UN...  I personal believe that a day
will come that maybe there will be some major riots in the US and the UN
will step up and tell the worlds police force to control its own people.
We as a country may or may not desire to be the worlds police force but
since we are a super power we can be forced into it (by the UN).  I do
know of some US presidents that really spat in the face of the UN for
various reasons.

DO I personally like the UN...  N/C

Now this message is part of a thread that talks about Echelon...  I have
one thing to say about that...  Why did somebody wake that beast again.
That is like 10-15 years old now...  There are better methods that are
being used than Echelon.  News broke about that system what 8-10 years
ago was it not?  Since news broke about it then, that means it was old
news when it broke..  SO why do we not talk about the reality that UFOs
are real and were Sponsored by the US, Canada, the former Soviet Union,
maybe China and Japan...  It is earthly technology and they are using
that to do the post modern data gathering.  ;)

should I toss in some Echelon key words at this time?
Na, I think I will leave it alone.

Peace out
--
Leif Ericksen

On Mon, 2005-12-26 at 16:49 +0100, GroundZero Security wrote:
> the usa still controls the internet and they dont give a fuck if we
> feel that our privacy is invaded since we are all foreign countries to them
> and anything outside the usa should be sniffed as they could be potential terrorists.
> remember only usa is the "free world" lol (in their opinion)
> they want total control and noone can do anything against their actions.
> 
> even nato is powerless against usa thats why noone ever says something if they
> fuck up. the us. gov  knows that exactly. they dont have to execuse themselfs for things
> not even to their own people. if they are forced to give out information they lie their way out.
> manipulation is something the us gov is specialized in.
> 
> with google earth you can even find a nsa echelon base in germany. i wonder what its doing there.
> i bet they use it to sniff our country aswell and our neighboors, since its not there for the fun of it.
> what if my country would start to spy on usa isp's ? that could cause serious political problems,
> but of course for usa everything is ok, as we have seen in the past.
> 
> oh and for your law question, usa doesnt care about international laws. if you have problems you
> will have to ask a us. court and i doubt that will help you much complaining about some agency
> especially when you are from some foreign country.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bipin Gautam" <gautam.bipin@...il.com>
> To: <full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk>
> Sent: Monday, December 26, 2005 4:04 PM
> Subject: [Full-disclosure] Spy Agency Mined Vast Data Trove
> 
> 
> > hello list;
> > 
> > story: http://www.securityfocus.com/brief/85
> > ----[snip]-----
> > At issue are the broad, sweeping powers the NSA now have to eavesdrop
> > on Americans without their knowledge. Commentary from Ars technical
> > speculates on the technology behind the massive eavesdropping. Bruce
> > Schneier has a long commentary on historical abuses as well as the
> > NSA's use of Echelon, a massive initiative that monitors voice, fax,
> > and data communications and is used for data mining of perhaps 3
> > billion communications per day.
> > ----[/snip]-----
> > 
> > My concern is... (I'm from Nepal) not all ISP in my region go through
> > the Nepal's Internet exchange point. so even the local traffic might
> > have routed through USA if our ISP'z backbone providr is in USA. I
> > don't have very good idea about ledal stuff but my basic assumption is
> > BUYING SERVICE FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY DOESN'T MEAN WE ARE
> > NECESSARILY SUBJECTED TO THEIR LOCAL RULES. (though depends on country
> > foreign policy)
> > 
> > Have our network traffic been spyed/sniffed too without our knowledge?
> > Don't we have right of protection in the law to check such thing if
> > any???
> > 
> > just willing to hear your views on what are the rules to check/tackle
> > such issues in other foreign countries???
> > 
> > regards,
> > -bipint
> > 
> > 
> > story: http://www.securityfocus.com/brief/85
> > ----[snip]-----
> > At issue are the broad, sweeping powers the NSA now have to eavesdrop
> > on Americans without their knowledge. Commentary from Ars technical
> > speculates on the technology behind the massive eavesdropping. Bruce
> > Schneier has a long commentary on historical abuses as well as the
> > NSA's use of Echelon, a massive initiative that monitors voice, fax,
> > and data communications and is used for data mining of perhaps 3
> > billion communications per day.
> > ----[/snip]-----
> > 
> > My concern is... (I'm from Nepal) not all ISP in my region go through
> > the Nepal's Internet exchange point. so even the local traffic might
> > have routed through USA if our ISP'z backbone providr is in USA. I
> > don't have very good idea about ledal stuff but my basic assumption is
> > BUYING SERVICE FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY DOESN'T MEAN WE ARE
> > NECESSARILY SUBJECTED TO THEIR LOCAL RULES. (though depends on country
> > foreign policy)
> > 
> > Have our network traffic been spyed/sniffed too without our knowledge?
> > Don't we have right of protection in the law to check such thing if
> > any???
> > 
> > just willing to hear your views on what are the rules to check/tackle
> > such issues in other foreign countries???
> > 
> > regards,
> > -bipin
> > --
> > 
> > Bipin Gautam
> > 
> > Zeroth law of security: The possibility of poking a system from lower
> > privilege is zero unless & until there is possibility of direct,
> > indirect or consequential communication between the two...
> > 
> 
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
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> _______________________________________________
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-- 
Leif Ericksen <leife@....net>

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