Message-ID: <12395eaf0901050346h7513bb0aka4e7414ede029a38@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 13:46:17 +0200
From: "Yudi Rosen" <yr42.lists@...il.com>
To: full-disclosure@...ts.grok.org.uk
Subject: Re: The war in Palestine

It's interesting to note how the PA Palestinians in the West Bank are living
peacefully - they're not launching attacks on Israeli citizens, and therefor
aren't being attacked back by Israel. In fact, many of them have jobs within
Israeli areas and receive benefits from the Israeli government (my source?
I'm there right now, I've asked to both Jews and Arabs about this).

Yet in Gaza, the ruling party (Hamas) has vowed not just to establish a
Palestinian country, but also to destroy Israel and kill every last Jew. And
they attempt to make good on their words by deliberately and specificly
targeting civillians, even killing other Palestinians in the proccess. In
order to defend it's own people (both Jews and Arabs), Israel launches this
latest battle.

THEN, (hoping to garner some sympathy for the Hamas cause, it seems?),
several people start a flamefight on a IT-security mailing list.

...anyone see what doesn't make sense here?

There are places to flame about this, FD doesn't seem like one of them.
Please let's get back on topic?



On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 10:17 AM, Avraham Schneider <avri.schneider@...il.com
> wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 9:25 AM, - o z - <osgo@...mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Jan 4, 2009, at 10:31 PM, Avraham Schneider wrote:
>>
>>  When there is no choice, there is no choice - Israel has to defend it's
>>> own
>>> civilian population as a first priority.
>>>
>>> Let me tell you a little of the latest events -
>>>
>>> 1) IDF calls a family in Gaza, to let them know they are about to bomb
>>> the
>>> house from the air - demanding that the family members leave immediately.
>>> (the IDF had inteligence that weapons were stored in that family's house)
>>> 2) Family members climb to the roof of the house as they know the IDF
>>> pilots
>>> would not want to harm civilians
>>> 3) The IDF pilot fires a rocket to the corner of the roof, making it
>>> clear
>>> that if they don't leave, they will die,
>>> 4) The family get the point and run away
>>> 5) House is fired at
>>> 6) Explosions ocur due to ammunition and rockets stored there.
>>>
>>
>> Correction #3:  The MC actually dispatched MIGCAP to fire 20mm cannon,
>> not 'rocket' -- at the next building over.   The kill ratio from a
>> rocket's shrapnel
>> would have killed anyone on the roof, hence, 20mm fire to ward off the
>> family
>> and scare the dickens out of them so they would bail from the structure.
>
> http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1052034.html
>  The IDF Spokesman said that Ghayan's house had served as a weapons silo
> and a war room for Hamas. Under the house, according to the IDF, was a
> tunnel which was meant to serve as an escape route in case of an Israeli
> attack.
> .
> .
> .
> The IDF has code named such operations "roof knocking," in which the army
> informs the residents of s suspected building that they have 10 minutes to
> leave the premises. In some cases, residents of suspected houses have been
> able to prevent bombing by climbing up to the roof to show that they will
> not leave, prompting IDF commanders to call off the strike. In these cases,
> Channel 10 reported Thursday, the IAF sometimes launches a relatively
> harmless missile at the corner of the roof, avoiding casualties but
> successfully dispersing the crowd.
> .
> .
> .
> It appears that the "roof knocking" technique was used in the
> assassination, but Ghayan decided to stay indoors with his family, and the
> army opted to bomb the house anyway.
> A lecturer at Gaza's Islamic University, Ghayan, 49, had mentored suicide
> bombers and would sometimes go on patrol with Hamas fighters. He was known
> for his close ties to the group's military wing and was respected in Gaza
> for donning combat fatigues and personally participating in clashes against
> Israeli forces. He sent one of his sons on an October 2001 suicide mission
> that killed two Israeli settlers in Gaza.
>
>
>
>>
>> #4:  Family found Jesus right away, no, Common Sense...and bailed from the
>> roof.
>>
>> #5:  Cool fireworks display courtesy of your local IDF
>>
>> #6:  Kudos to family for making a media moment of defiance, but it was
>> really time
>> to leave before someone was killed.
>>
>>
>>>> 2009/1/4  <Valdis.Kletnieks@...edu>:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You people can't even agree to stop a flame war.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  It's not a flame war - it's an off-topic propaganda started by a Muslim
>>> and
>>> defended by a Jew.
>>> Just add the subject to a filter rule in Outlook/gmail/whatever client
>>> you
>>> use, and forget about it.
>>>
>>
>> Defended by two Jews now, Mazel tov!!!!
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
>>
>>  --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Condoleezza Rice is a very cruel, offended woman who lacks men's
>> attention. She needs to be taken to a company of man-soldiers and it would
>> be just fine. Releasing such stupid remarks gives her the feeling of being
>> fulfilled. This is the only way for her to attract men's attention.  Show me
>> that Rice is a woman? The only thing she attracts is reindeer. The States
>> needs to practice the old Soviet tradition when both single women and single
>> men were not allowed to take responsible state positions..."
>>
>> --Vladimir Zhirinovsky,  Russian politician, rabid leader of the Liberal
>> and Democratic Party of Russia (LDPR)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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