linux-kernel - Re: [Ksummit-2013-discuss] DT bindings as ABI [was: Do we have people interested in device tree janitoring / cleanup?]

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Date:	Thu, 01 Aug 2013 08:48:19 -0500
From:	Rob Herring <robherring2@...il.com>
To:	David Woodhouse <dwmw2@...radead.org>
CC:	"jonsmirl@...il.com" <jonsmirl@...il.com>,
	Russell King - ARM Linux <linux@....linux.org.uk>,
	Mark Rutland <mark.rutland@....com>,
	"devicetree@...r.kernel.org" <devicetree@...r.kernel.org>,
	"ksummit-2013-discuss@...ts.linuxfoundation.org" 
	<ksummit-2013-discuss@...ts.linuxfoundation.org>,
	Ian Campbell <ian.campbell@...rix.com>,
	Pawel Moll <Pawel.Moll@....com>,
	Richard Cochran <richardcochran@...il.com>,
	"linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	Tomasz Figa <tomasz.figa@...il.com>,
	Jason Gunthorpe <jgunthorpe@...idianresearch.com>,
	Domenico Andreoli <cavokz@...il.com>, mbizon@...ebox.fr,
	Dave P Martin <Dave.Martin@....com>,
	"linux-arm-kernel@...ts.infradead.org" 
	<linux-arm-kernel@...ts.infradead.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-2013-discuss] DT bindings as ABI [was: Do we have people
 interested in device tree janitoring / cleanup?]

On 08/01/2013 05:18 AM, David Woodhouse wrote:
> On Wed, 2013-07-31 at 17:26 -0400, jonsmirl@...il.com wrote:
>> Alternatively you may be of the belief that it is impossible to get
>> rid of the board specific code. But x86 doesn't have any of it, why
>> should ARM?
> 
> The reason x86 doesn't have it is because it carries three decades worth
> of legacy baggage so that it can still look like a 1980s IBM PC when
> necessary.
> 
> There *have* been some x86 platforms which abandon that legacy crap, and
> for those we *do* have board-specific code. (Is James still maintaining
> Voyager support? It feels very strange to talk about Voyager with it
> *not* being the 'legacy crap' in question...)
> 
> We've even seen *recent* attempts to abandon the legacy crap in the
> embedded x86 space, which backtracked and added it all back again — in
> part because x86 lacked any sane way to describe the hardware if it
> wasn't pretending to be a PC. ACPI doesn't cut it, and DT "wasn't
> invented here"...
>
> Unless you want the ARM world to settle on a strategy of "all the world
> is an Assabet", I'd be careful what you wish for...

There is some level of belief that ACPI will enable running this years
OS on next years h/w. This idea is completely flawed as long as ARM
vendors don't design for compatibility, spin the Si for compatibility
issues, and have some mechanism to emulate legacy h/w. All the
discussions and issues around DT bindings and processes will apply to
ACPI bindings as well.

Rob
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