Message-ID: <20150211040957.GC21356@htj.duckdns.org>
Date:	Tue, 10 Feb 2015 23:09:57 -0500
From:	Tejun Heo <tj@...nel.org>
To:	"Serge E. Hallyn" <serge@...lyn.com>
Cc:	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@...ssion.com>,
	Richard Weinberger <richard@....at>,
	Linux API <linux-api@...r.kernel.org>,
	Linux Containers <containers@...ts.linux-foundation.org>,
	Serge Hallyn <serge.hallyn@...ntu.com>,
	"linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
	Andy Lutomirski <luto@...capital.net>,
	cgroups mailinglist <cgroups@...r.kernel.org>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo@...hat.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCHv3 8/8] cgroup: Add documentation for cgroup namespaces

On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 04:46:16AM +0100, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
> 1. Hierarchy_num in /proc/cgroups and /proc/self/cgroup start at 0.  Used
> to start with 1.  I expect many userspace parsers to be broken by this.

This is intentional.  The unified hierarchy will always have the
hierarchy number zero.  Userland needs to be updated anyway and the
unified hierarchy won't show up unless explicitly enabled.

> 2. After creating every non-leaf cgroup, we must fill in the
> cgroup.subtree_cgroups file.  This is extra work which userspace
> doesn't have to do right now.

Again, by design.  This is how organization and control are separated
and the differing levels of granularity is achieved.

> 3. Let's say we want to create a freezer cgroup /foo/bar for some set of

There shouldn't be a "freezer" cgroup.  The processes are categorized
according to their logical structure and controllers are applied to
the hierarchy as necessary.

> tasks, which they will administer.  In fact let's assume we are going to
> use cgroup namespaces.  We have to put the tasks into /foo/bar, unshare
> the cgroup ns, then create /foo/bar/leaf, move the tasks into /foo/bar/leaf,
> and then write 'freezer' into /foo/bar.  (If we're not using cgroup
> namespaces, then we have to do a similar thing to let the tasks administer
> /foo/bar while placing them under /foo/bar/leaf).  The oddness I'm pointing
> to is where the tasks have to know that they can create cgroups in "..".
> 
> For containers this becomes odd.  We tend to group containers by the
> tasks in and under a cgroup.  We now will have to assume a convention
> where we know to check for tasks in and under "..", since by definition
> pid 1's cgroup (in a container) cannot have children.

The semantics is that the parent enables distribution of its given
type of resource by enabling the controller in its subtree_control.
This scoping isn't necessary for freezer and I'm debating whether to
enable controllers which don't need granularity control to be enabled
unconditionally.  Right now, I'm leaning against it mostly for
consistency.

> 4. The per-cgroup "tasks" file not existing seems odd, although certainly
> unexpected by much current software.

And, yes, everything is per-process for reasons described in
unified-hierarchy.txt.

> So, if the unified hierarchy is going to not cause undue pain, existing
> software really needs to start working now to use it.  It's going to be
> a sizeable task for lxc.

Yes, this isn't gonna be a trivial conversion.  The usage model
changes and so will a lot of controller knobs and behaviors.

Thanks.

-- 
tejun
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