phc-discussions - RE: [PHC] Opinions sought on whether a specific side-channel leakage is ok.

lists.openwall.net		lists / announce owl-users owl-dev john-users john-dev passwdqc-users yescrypt popa3d-users / oss-security kernel-hardening musl sabotage tlsify passwords / crypt-dev xvendor / Bugtraq Full-Disclosure linux-kernel linux-netdev linux-ext4 linux-hardening linux-cve-announce PHC
Open Source and information security mailing list archives

Hash Suite for Android: free password hash cracker in your pocket

[<prev] [next>] [<thread-prev] [thread-next>] [day] [month] [year] [list]

Message-ID: <0dd1d27446134b36aeae7590e4111369@BY2PR03MB074.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 19:19:46 +0000
From: Marsh Ray <maray@...rosoft.com>
To: "discussions@...sword-hashing.net" <discussions@...sword-hashing.net>,
	Peter Maxwell <peter@...icient.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [PHC] Opinions sought on whether a specific side-channel
 leakage is ok.

From: Krisztián Pintér [mailto:pinterkr@...il.com] 
>
> Peter Maxwell (at Monday, January 27, 2014, 4:20:55 PM):
> > Without exposing too much of my intended design, I'd like to garner 
> > some opinion if that is possible.
>
> you are not going to file a patent, are you?

For the record, similar ideas have been floated before.

> > So, lets say we can associate a given password with a scalar password 
> > complexity measure in the interval [0,1] with an as yet to be defined 
> > distribution.
>
> here is my objection, above the obvious leak issue. calculating password strength is difficult. it will be a damn complex
> algorithm, supported by tables, many equations and a sizeable dictionary.

What is the entropy of 'Pa$$word1'?

Or a password for which the hash has been exposed in a data breach and possibly cracked?

'Complexity' might be something that an individual site could define on it's own. But making a standard definition of 'strength' or 'password entropy' seems basically impossible.

- Marsh

----------------------------
My own opinions, usual disclaimers apply.